The Lost Blog

Key Points from "Everybody Loves Hugo"

Season 6, Episode 12
Episode Air Date: 04/13/10

Point 1

Hurley Michael Jack Ilana

BOOM goes the dynamite!

BOOM goes Ilana!

BOOM goes the Black Rock!

I could probably stop there. I probably should stop there since it's awfully tough to outdo massive pyrotechnics. But the weird thing is that as the final seconds of the episode played out, I'd almost forgotten about those fireballs. They seemed like a distant memory ... relegated to the same part of my grey matter where Dr. Arzt and his cravat reside. I guess that's proof that as "Lost" nears its conclusion, the episodes are growing denser and denser.

Let's dive in (... or fall in, if an ancient well is handy).

I want to begin with one of the clearest answers we've ever received. And I want to appreciate that clarity, too, because many times "Lost's" answers are woven deep into the fabric of the series; almost to the point where we don't completely see them (this is a big reason why I think many folks still get frustrated at a lack of answers, even though we know far, far more than we did a few seasons ago). So let's be as overt as possible.

Question: What are the whispers?

Answer (courtesy Ghost Michael): They're the souls of the dead who are unable to move on because they did Very Bad Things while among the living. Put another way: the island is purgatory ... but it's not only purgatory.

Now, of course the usual disclaimers apply: Ghost Michael might have been lying (although I think not) and Hurley might have hallucinated the whole exchange (again, I think not).

But let's put that aside for a moment and consider the ramifications here. I'm trying to recall if previous "whisper" encounters have always been tied to some sort of event -- e.g. Does it rain after the whispers are heard? Does Smokey appear? Does the Hurley Bird descend? For the life of me, I can't remember a pattern. The whispers just sort of popped up on random occasions. (The one whispery event that really sticks out to me, though, is when one-time island therapist Harper Stanhope suddenly "appeared" to Juliet amidst a swirl of whispering.)

But even if the whispers don't signal anything, and the accompanying souls don't have any particular role to play on the island, I do have a host of questions about these things:

1. Can Hurley only see whisper souls? We know he's had encounters with Charlie, Ana Lucia, Eko, Michael, Isabella and Jacob. I can see how Charlie, Ana, Eko and Michael could be trapped -- all did things that generally run afoul of "being good." But unless Isabella had a stormy history we don't know about, I don't see how she falls into the purgatory group. And Jacob? I have no idea who or what he is (beyond a douchebag ... and I don't think that's a full-fledged sin), so let's not bother with him.

2. Why hasn't dead Libby appeared to Hurley? Did she immediately move on?

3. Can messages from the dead be trusted? This is a big one because Hurley blindly -- and perhaps stupidly -- takes orders from Ghost Michael. Think about the potentially cataclysmic chain of events set in motion here: Hurley, acting on Michael's recommendation, destroys the Black Rock. This leads to Richard, Miles and Ben forming a splinter faction to destroy Ajira 316 on their own. And, since they've got nothing else to do and nowhere else to go, Hurley, Jack, Sun and Frank decide to ignore their deep concerns about Flocke and walk right into his camp. This is precisely what Flocke was hoping and waiting for. Considering how all this played out, I think it's fair to doubt Michael's motivations. Or, at minimum, his control.

And speaking of Flocke ...

4. What's the relationship between the whispering souls and the Man in Black? I'm convinced there's a connection because everyone knows you can't have dead souls and a smoke monster occupying the same land mass without some sort of crossover. It's one of the immutable laws of the Hawking/Faraday paradigm.

Okay, that's enough whispering for now.

There are a couple other island developments I want to note:

-- Here's a handy travel tip: If you're ever vacationing in a tropical land and someone says, in direct address, "the island is done with you," use whatever energy and mental fortitude you possess to get the hell off the island. Most won't receive such a warning (to date, Michael is the only one who received that courtesy ... and his warning came while standing before a table of explosives). But if you do, take it and use it. I got the distinct sense that Ben's line -- "Makes me wonder what's going to happen when it's done with us" -- is an ominous bit of foreshadowing.

-- I think Jack is now the favorite to claim Jacob's throne. In a bit of self-reflection more commonly seen in the flash-sideways, island Jack admits that perhaps his entire journey -- his entire purpose -- is about letting go of his psychotic need to fix things. That is a HUGE shift for this guy and it would seem to fit right into Jacob's wacky mandate that candidates figure things out for themselves.

Point 2

Hurley Libby Desmond

This episode features two big developments in the alternate universe:

First: Hurley and Libby finally get their picnic. It's a sweet little scene and it's nice to see these two get a moment in the sun (it's also nice to see Libby without a bullet in her gut). But the important part of their alternate-universe meeting -- and subsequent date -- is that each is now aware of their island existence. It looks like the same love-based bond that awoke Charlie and Desmond has also zapped Hurley and Libby.

Second: Desmond for most of this episode appears to be playing cupid. He cleverly directs Hurley toward Libby and then lets their attraction do the rest. But in the final moments, Des pays a visit to the high school where John Locke and Dr. Benjamin Linus teach. And this is when Cupid turns oddly homicidal. Des rams Locke with his car, and it's unclear if this is all part of his master plan or if it's in response to Flocke's on-island actions (more on that in Key Point 3).

I'm sure Desmond's motivations will be revealed, but in the meantime let's take a look at the characters still on his "to-awaken" list:

There's the original 815ers: Jack, Kate, Sawyer, Claire, Sun, Jin, Sayid, Boone, Shannon, and Locke (and Nikki and Paulo and Arzt and Rose if you want to get technical ... but c'mon now).

There's the tailies: Ana Lucia and Eko (wouldn't count on either of these).

And if Desmond decides to expand his list beyond the Oceanic manifest, there's also the freighter folk: Miles and Frank most notably, but Charlotte and Daniel still need to get together. And I'm assuming Des will find a way to convince Minkowski, but I guess he's still unconfirmed, too.

Am I missing anyone?

Point 3

Island Desmond

So after telling Desmond that Charles Widmore isn't to be trusted, and then noticing that Des really isn't afraid of anything or anyone, Flocke chucks our happy Scot into an ancient well. It's a deep hole, but not insanely deep, so I'm guessing Des is still alive.

And that begs the questions: Who's being played here? Did Desmond actually think he was talking to John Locke? Or, was he working an angle on Flocke all along?

Desmond has always been one of my favorite characters, so I'm certainly biased, but I get the impression that he isn't actually working for anyone. He's communing with the island, or maybe even the power that guides the island. And that's got to be much more of a threat to Flocke than Widmore will ever be.

And while we're talking about threats ... Flocke and Desmond both see a dark-haired boy in the jungle. He appears to be the same age as the blond boy we saw previously (i.e. "unconfirmed young Jacob"), so I think it's safe to assume this is "unconfirmed young MIB." And Flocke was none too pleased to see him. Can "unconfirmed crazy mother" be far behind?

Point 4

Island

A few closing questions and observations:

  • Best Line: "You need a woman in your life. Especially one who hasn't nursed you." -- Mrs. Reyes to Hurley.
  • Second Best Line: "How do you break the ice with a smoke monster?" -- Hurley to Jack.
  • Third Best Line: "If that's not the best argument against captivity I've ever heard, I don't know what is." -- Flocke to Desmond, after Des says he's got nowhere to run.
  • I'm enjoying the unintentional hilarity of Jack asking Hurley who he's talking to. It happened with Jacob. It happened with Isabella. And in this episode, it happens with Michael. This is Jack we're talking about. Mr. Science! And now, he casually asks which dead person Hurley might be speaking with. ("Hey ... tell Ana she looked good in them jeans! And tell Eko I loved that beard! And oh! Let me know when Tupac shows up!")
  • I've invested an unhealthy number of hours watching "Seinfeld," which is why I loved the subtle shout-out to George Costanza's favorite charity, The Human Fund.
  • We now know of three characters who share a direct connection to a museum in the flash sideways world: Pierre Chang and Charlotte both work there and Hurley funded the new paleontology wing. Miles and Sawyer are both one degree away from it, too. Perhaps the museum will act as a locus of flash-sidewaysness; the Kevin Bacon in the Losties' alternate reality (can you tell I'm getting punchy?).

That's all I've got!

Next Episode:

"The Last Recruit" -- Looks like this is a Jack episode. Maybe. I don't know if "character-centric" still applies. Airs Tuesday, April 20, 2010 at 9 p.m. on ABC.

All photos and episode descriptions © ABC Inc.

Maybe First?

#1. Posted by: shikotee at April 14, 2010 12:04 AM

YAY first!!!

#2. Posted by: nidia at April 14, 2010 12:04 AM

MIF!

#3. Posted by: meg at April 14, 2010 12:04 AM

All I can say is... what the.....?? what the....??

#4. Posted by: erin at April 14, 2010 12:08 AM

Well, in the coming attractions, they show Des in the well w/ Sayid at the top w/ a gun, then shows Sayid firing said gun. So, for now, at least, it appears Des is still alive.

#5. Posted by: erin at April 14, 2010 12:17 AM

Was it just me, or did anyone find the Ilana KABOOM rather meh? I think I'm just annoyed because I expected her and Ben to at least snog! Just seemed like she was snagging Arzt's schtick.

So - We have Miles, Ben, and Ricardus heading to the boats. Could this be the time for Juliette to shoot someone? My money is on Miles.

#6. Posted by: shikotee at April 14, 2010 12:17 AM

One more thing......

WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAALT!!

THEY TOOK MY SON!!!

#7. Posted by: shikotee at April 14, 2010 12:20 AM

I, too, am more than a little sceptical about whatever ghost-Michael has to say. Just doesn't seem trustworthy.

Mac-- very funny about cupid turning homicidal-- lmao. What was Desmond's point behind the hit-and-run?

I kind of thought Ilana was being a little careless with the bag of unstable dynamite!! Throwing water bottles and other items on top of them in her carry-bag...what was she thinking!?

#8. Posted by: erin at April 14, 2010 12:24 AM

Here we thought Illana was a stand-in for Anna Lucia and it turns out she was a stand in for Leslie Arzt, instead.

#9. Posted by: Cecil Rose at April 14, 2010 12:24 AM

We might just have to run Dr. Shephard through a refresher course before we renew his NRA card. He was carrying that rifle awful carelessly pointed back in Sun's general direction.

#10. Posted by: Cecil at April 14, 2010 12:27 AM

So, were there 2 different jungle boys lurking and spying? I thought it was the same kid? How many more kids are going to show up... is this "The Lord of the Flies"?

#11. Posted by: erin at April 14, 2010 12:30 AM

I sure hope that Vincent doesn't come up to Hurley or Miles with a message that *Dessie's in the well*!

#12. Posted by: lostncyberspace at April 14, 2010 12:51 AM

Totally did not expect Ilana's blow out. Had heard...
SPOILER ALERT!!
...that Ben has some romance in his future. Just kind of assumed it would be Ilana. Wrongo!! :) Maybe in Altverse.
END OF SPOILER


Laughed out loud when she exploded. That was the bomb!! (Not Jughead.)

#13. Posted by: Crispy Seaplanes at April 14, 2010 12:54 AM

GRAA Mac!

-This episode felt like a turning point for me. Although Michael's motives are not 100% clear and he could even have been MIB in disguise ---he certainly seemed to have served MIB's goals well--- it feels like the show has fully committed to the whole ghost thing now. Do I like it? No, not a bit, but hey, that's the risk of getting answers, you might not like them. Why don't I like it? First, it feels like they're changing the rules in the last stretch of the story, with all the supernatural entities floating around suddenly. Second, how exactly does it make sense that the Island in the form of Christian (assuming that that was The Island) tells Michael that he is done and can go (just before he blows up), and then he keeps his ghost (ugh...) trapped? What kind of sadistic Island is this? And the people that appeared off-Island to Hurley, like Charlie, are they trapped as well?

-So was Ilana Arzt under these bandages?

-I couldn't make up my mind if jungle boy was different from the previous one. At first I thought he was, but then he looked familiar. Have we seen him at the Temple?

-Mac, don't forget Bernard with the Tailies. Can't awaken Rose and forget her hubby.

-Will Vincent tell someone that Desmond fell down the well?

-And Jack swings back. This guy goes from going with the flow, to promising to fix things, back to blindly following the ghost whisperer. The last person on the show with this lack of mental stability was Locke before his demise. I guess it's fitting, since Jack is turning into Locke 2.0. Hence the staring contest between him and Flocke. It was Island!Jack's own mirror scene. Btw, I think his presence in Flocke's Flock will drive MIB crazy and he will sink the Island himself to be rid of Mr. Moodswing.

-Jack and Hurley hadn't seen Flocke before this episode, had they?

-I didn't catch The Human Fund reference. Was that when Pierre Chang listed Hugo's philanthropism?

-I quite liked the bits in the jungle. Felt like the early days.

#14. Posted by: Plain Simple at April 14, 2010 1:06 AM

lostncyberspace @12 just beat me to the Dessie joke. Damn me for typing these long posts. ;)

#15. Posted by: Plain Simple at April 14, 2010 1:07 AM

One more thing, Mac. The link in the first line of your "Key Points" doesn't seem to be working.

#16. Posted by: Plain Simple at April 14, 2010 1:10 AM

I laughed when Desmond hit Locke with the car because it seemed so out of character and a bit...silly for LOST (yes silly despite the time travel/mysticism hehe). And part of me thought that Desmond did it to revive Locke somehow or maybe now the MIB is in two dimensions? Hmm.

I hope that next week we'll see Locke miraculously walk, but who knows.

And I was surprised by the insta-death of Ilana, and maybe moreso that the Losties didn't mourn or freak in the slightest; like it was a commonplace. o_O;

#17. Posted by: Silhouette at April 14, 2010 1:13 AM

Remember in last weeks episode when Charlie had his Island "remembrances". He had these memories while he was dying. Charlie then drove the car into the ocean so Desmond could remember his "side-past". I think Desmond ran over Locke so he would have the same experiences.

#18. Posted by: Haley at April 14, 2010 1:24 AM

@18. Posted by: Haley

Yeah - that sounds good. You'd think he'd at least first try talking to him.

I thought it was funny that Ben may have been worried that Desmond was a pedo, stalking the school.

#19. Posted by: shikotee at April 14, 2010 1:29 AM

So, I read an interview stating that we would get an answer to the "Hurley Bird" mystery. It actually didn't seem sarcastic but hey I guess if we didn't get it now, we never will... damn.

#20. Posted by: Lostaddict at April 14, 2010 1:32 AM

The young boy we encountered during this episode is almost certainly the MIB. I am a bit confused as to why present-day Flocke is unaware of the purpose of his stick whittling and bark shaving but the parallel between Flocke's stick and the boy's suggests they are the same. On another note, the boy looked kind of like a young Jacob so maybe the final 10 minutes of the show will be Flocke and the successful candidate having a stick fight reminiscent of Darth Maul's skills in Star Wars.

#21. Posted by: l0stb0y at April 14, 2010 1:32 AM

Interesting that Desmond ran into Ben before ramming into Locke. Remembered that Desmond and Ben have never met before.

Can other strong emotions besides love trigger the flashes since not everyone had love on the island? Locke has Helen in the sideways world and lost her in the regular one.

Sadly there are not enough episodes left for Des to intervene one by one so group events must be coming. The previous quantum leap reference seems even more appropriate after seeing Des on a mission to "right what once went wrong".

#22. Posted by: Addicted to LOST at April 14, 2010 1:42 AM

Well well well...here we are again...things seem to be getting pretty interesting pretty fast!...It seems at least to me that since Desmond had the encounters in the box, that he is the all knowing being of the Island. That is why he says he has nothing to fear, because he already know whats going to happen, and is just playing THE MIB. He also already seems to be taking the role of Jacob off the Island with the whole idea of getting the flight manifest, and visiting everyone to make them remember. Well in any case Desmond will be around till the end.

#23. Posted by: K-F-Hugo at April 14, 2010 1:53 AM

My question is, What was in the bag that Hurley picked up, that "changed his mind" (not really)..
There was probably an ancient "well" in Tunisia at some point, because that's where you end up if you turn the donkey wheel... Electromagnetism on the island does something to keep smokey at bay, which is why they always use those funky tesla coil looiking things to keep him out. Desmond's "sacrifice" will inevitably be some kind of "pushing the button, or turning the wheel" moment, which will destroy Flocke's chances of leaving, which is why Flocke sent Des on the fast track to welldom..

#24. Posted by: jsoxgvlsc at April 14, 2010 1:53 AM

IMDB has the "Boy" listed in this episode and The Substitute as the same actor. I know IMDB isn't the most trusted source, but I doubt they'd screw up on such a minor character.

I think his hair just looked darker in that scene, his features looked the exact same to me...

#25. Posted by: Ross at April 14, 2010 2:04 AM

Ok, so Desmond knows something important enough to nearly fatally wound Locke. My guess is that Locke will have a vision, and Jack will be his surgeon, and this will lead to Jack's vision as well. Still don't know what's with the gaze that these two shared on the island near the end of the episode..

#26. Posted by: jsoxgvlsc at April 14, 2010 2:12 AM

So Rosalita stood up Hurley? Hmmm, wonder if she'll turn up next week as Ana Lucia?

#27. Posted by: fripa at April 14, 2010 2:42 AM

Not sure Michael is working for MIB?? MIB said that he would kill the candidates, but he has to play by the rules. He obviously can't kill them otherwise he would have as smokey. Wonder if he's playing them against each other to kill each other. If so, you would have thought that Michael would be more encouraging about bringing explosives to the plane. Then again, perhaps MIB has to get them on the plane making sense of why Michael would discourage their blowing it up.

#28. Posted by: fripa at April 14, 2010 3:24 AM

How did Hurley know that Michael killed Lybby and Ana Lucia?

#29. Posted by: Dexterously at April 14, 2010 3:53 AM

Mac asked, "Am I missing anyone?"

Um, you listed Rose....but didn't include Bernard w/ the rest of the Tailies.

Doubt we'll see Eko but my money is on Ana-Lucia being Alt Miles' girlfriend.

#30. Posted by: PZ at April 14, 2010 6:13 AM

I feel this may be a completely ridiculous comment, but I was kind of shocked that Michael is, well, dead. In hindsight, this is forcefully implied by the whole freighter ka-blammo sequence back in Season 5, but I kind of assumed old Mike would pop up again after a miraculous survival and draw the old "I'm gong to find my son" card.

Call me old-school, but I feel like it just ain't Lost without Michael lookin' for Waaaaaaaalt!

#31. Posted by: Jin + Tonic at April 14, 2010 6:24 AM

Not only was this episode dense, it was filled with sudden jumps in character. Hurley taking leadership, people following him, Jack's self realization, Desmond's I-understand-everything-and-you-don't smirk plus his homicidal attack on Locke, Michael the ghost. To me, it was disappointing. The writers cleaning out their desks and saying it's time to work on our resumes. We've got only a few episodes left to wrap things up. Let's see, they all die, the island goes back to being the island, jungle boy grows up (which is why he is looking different, he is growing faster than Walt) and they all live happily after after in Alternate universe as if none of it ever happened other than rendering them better people. Jungle boy could grow up into MIB as suggested above, giving MIB a real body but leaving him trapped on the island. Or Jungle boy could turn into Jacob. I am with you on this Plain Simple, This episode has been a turning point for me too. I even dreamt a little bit about it last night. Maybe I'll get a better idea after I have thought about it for a while. More likely the rest of you will give me a better idea of what this episode meant.

#32. Posted by: August Paul at April 14, 2010 6:49 AM

Oh yes, one other question. Where is Christian when we need him?

#33. Posted by: August Paul at April 14, 2010 6:50 AM

@18. Posted by: Haley

That's exactly what I thought.

Somehow Desmond's new task is getting everybody to remember their other lives on the island. Perhaps it's his assignment by Charles Widmore on the island.

#34. Posted by: SnakeJake at April 14, 2010 6:53 AM

The whispers revelation was the first "answer" that felt really underwhelming to me. It seemed like the easiest way out to explain them. Like August Paul said the writers clearing out their desks.
"Oh we forgot to explain the whispers"
"They could be the voices of the dead..."
"No that's too easy. Besides Hugo hasn't heard the voices every time before seeing a spirit..."And if theyre trapped on the island how have we seen some of these spirits off the island?""
"Who cares? They'll lap it up just happy to have an answer..."
"Yeah you're right lets just get this out of the way and move along"

I guess I don't mind. Just seems there were more creative theories out there involving voices leaking through from time loops or something more creative. I really wouldn't have cared if we hadn't gotten a definitive answer on the whispers. They never seemed like that big a deal that I needed an answer. One of those cases where maybe the answer is less satisfying than the mystery and a good case for the writers not to feel a need to answer every single question.

#35. Posted by: Crispy Seaplanes at April 14, 2010 7:27 AM

I enjoyed this episode and was surprised quite a few times. Since last week's episode started this chain of events with Desmond...the two universes connecting...feel like each episode from here on end will continue with that, probably picking up speed. During Dr. Chang's tribute, "Everybody Loves Hugo", noticed the first slide of Cluckees (can't remember name of Hurley's restaurant chain), was of a "new" store...looked like his first store that was destroyed by the meteor. The banner on the roof read, "Grand Re-Opening". My thought was that int he alt-world, Hurley's good luck and success came despite his "bad luck" with his first restaurant's destruction (and death of the realtor lady). Unlike his flashback world...that seemed to be the deciding factor for him that his was bad luck and that the lottery winnings and he were cursed.

Des definitely knows stuff. (In addition to his consciousness of both universes...think there's more...) That smirk on his face tells it all. Think that Flocke noticed that and may not be certain of what is up, but knows that Des is up to something.

#36. Posted by: Boodle at April 14, 2010 7:32 AM

#12...we had the same twisted thought (apologies to Timmy and Lassie)!

"Hi Boy"
"Woof"
"What? What's wrong, boy?"
"WOOF!"
"Desmond's in trouble?"
"WOOF, WOOF!!"
"He fell in the well? We better get dad!"

#37. Posted by: bearandbu at April 14, 2010 7:48 AM

@24 Posteed by jsoxgvlsc

I thought the bag that Hurley picked up contains Jacob's ashes

#38. Posted by: opserc at April 14, 2010 7:48 AM

I feel sorry for Michael.

Looking back, he was excited to becoming a father, to the point of crib shopping before he was born, I think.

Then, he loved Walt so much as a baby and was torn apart when his girlfriend wouldn't be a part of his life and then married another man, who was going to adopt Walt. This was all with Michael being the best father he could possibly be, as far as I could see.

Then when he finally gets him back, they crash on this island. I only saw his love for his son. It was a horrible nightmare decision that he had to decide between getting his son back and letting the Others have Jack, Kate and Sawyer, but it's not exactly the crime of the centry! There was the possibility that Katejacksawyer could escape, but he was so torn. What if he chose Katejacksawyer over his son and THAT was the bad thing?

All I ever thought was, poor Michael. What a horrible position he finds himself in, time after time after time, generally through no fault of his own. Talk about a tortured life!

I probably have forgotten something major that made him be one of the "lost souls" that have to stay behind, but I still always felt sorry for him.

#39. Posted by: sandivon at April 14, 2010 8:00 AM

I really think that Sayid is pulling a long con on the MIB. He seemed more aware last night. Maybe Desmond showed him the light. BTW, how did Des & Sayid get back to the main island. Did they swim?

#40. Posted by: lost2theworld at April 14, 2010 8:03 AM

Am I the only one that applauded when Des ran over Locke? It was a dirty job, but somebody had to do it! Not sure what the implications will be, but it sure felt good to me. I've had nothing but negative vibes from Locke since the very beginning.

#41. Posted by: Grace at April 14, 2010 8:06 AM

It almost seems like Des is trying to 'set things' back on the right path after Charlie opens his eyes to reality?

#42. Posted by: michumz at April 14, 2010 8:19 AM

Claire will have her "vision of love" when she has Aaron. Everyone else is converging on the hospital so most likely theirs will happen there.

Did anyone notice that Libby's doctors name was Dr. Burke?

#43. Posted by: lost2theworld at April 14, 2010 8:28 AM

Des really pissed off Flocke at the well. Flocke likes people to be afraid of him and when Des just smiled at him he lost it. And yes, we do see Des in the well with Lassie - I mean Vincent running to get help.

@ 38 - Yes, I think you're correct on the ashes of Jacob.

I don't think the writers are doing anything but wrapping up the show. I certainly didn't feel as if they were just slapping things together to tie it up in a nice package.

And you don't ram your car into anyone at that speed to "Wake them up" - you do that to kill them.

#44. Posted by: dk at April 14, 2010 8:33 AM

@#39 sandivon

Michael's reservation on Purgatory Island could be due to the fact that he killed Anna Lucia and Libby. Although, Libby's death was accidental, but I think he intended on shooting Ana Lucia, if I remember correctly. But, do agree with you somewhat...Michael was always a tortured soul...

#45. Posted by: Boodle at April 14, 2010 8:33 AM

@#10 Cecil "We might just have to run Dr. Shephard through a refresher course before we renew his NRA card. He was carrying that rifle awful carelessly pointed back in Sun's general direction."

I thought that same thing.

#46. Posted by: zup at April 14, 2010 8:36 AM

#45. Posted by: Boodle

yikes! DUH! I totally forgot that (outright SAYING it last night wasn't a big enough reminder for me, I guess) OK, I still feel sorry for him but at least I understand. Thanks for the reminder.

#47. Posted by: sandivon at April 14, 2010 8:43 AM

#45. Posted by: Boodle

...by the way, that was a very kind way of explaining my confusion with something that was very obvious. Thank you for your tact.

#48. Posted by: sandivon at April 14, 2010 8:48 AM

It would have been so much better if Desmond would have kissed Lock to wake him up to his island experience.

#49. Posted by: lostguru at April 14, 2010 8:49 AM

"Ahh ... Ilana careful with that bag ... don't shove a water bottle into it ... hey don't just drop it because you might ...BOOM GOES THE DYNAMITE"

Very silly indeed. Only outdone by Desmond mowing down Locke. Enjoyed seeing that in slo mo a few times.

I said it before and I'll say it again, the writers have created such a convoluted mess that there is no way they can unravel it all in the remaining 4-5 episodes.

#50. Posted by: gables79 at April 14, 2010 8:53 AM

Desmond tells Ben he has a son named Charlie......that pretty much confirms that at least alt Des knows everything.

#51. Posted by: lostsox at April 14, 2010 8:56 AM

I thought in previous seasons the whispers always seemed to preceed Others sightings (although I could be remembering wrong). I remember Ben telling Danielle as he was stealing Alex something along the lines of, "if you hear whispers in the jungle, run the other way." I wonder why? Are these "lost souls" vindictive, or was that just a ploy to keep her scared and in hiding? Either way, Ben acknowledged the whispers, so I wonder if he even knows what they are or what they respresent, or if somebody/something can control them.

Also, Desmond's job of tracking down the other 815ers sure just got a lot harder now that he is a hit and run suspect, with many witnesses. Perhaps the next two people he meets will be a couple of cops, hmm....maybe even a recently captured Kate?

#52. Posted by: Artz Vandelay at April 14, 2010 9:03 AM

Wow.

I think the boy we saw was supposed to be MIB. He had dark hair as opposed to Jacob being blonde. I interpreted this to mean they were twins (hence the same actor playing both).

It really seems that Des no longer has to 'jump' between realities - he can be both places simultaneously. Throw me into a well and I ram you with a car!

Didn't Shannon hear the whispers when she was ghost walt? Weren't they speaking backwards? I always thought the whispers were the 'lost souls' of the island, so it really didn't surprise me much. Is Libby not on the island b/c she was murdered? Didn't she come as a nurse in Jack's hospital room? Maybe I need more coffee....

#53. Posted by: Other Kate at April 14, 2010 9:05 AM

@#48 sandivon

Not a problem. We have all been confused at one point or another during this adventure.

@#51 lostsox Desmond tells Ben he has a son named Charlie......that pretty much confirms that at least alt Des knows everything.

Exactly!! That was my point in #36. Desmond is definitely aware of both universes and although Hurley got a glimpse of Island Hurley in alt-universe, not certain if Island Hurley was aware of alt-Hurley. More to come, I'm sure...

#54. Posted by: Boodle at April 14, 2010 9:05 AM

55th!!!! :-)

namaste!!!

#55. Posted by: tiffani at April 14, 2010 9:07 AM

Anyone notice that Dez's chicken order was #42?

ANTDCO=42

#56. Posted by: Kevooon at April 14, 2010 9:12 AM

Was last night the first time it was confirmed that the altverse flight number was #815? Des said it when he asked Hurley, "Weren't you on Oceanic Flight 815?"

#57. Posted by: Hurley Is Hot at April 14, 2010 9:16 AM

@33. Posted by: August Paul
re: Where is Christian when we need him?

Tell me about it! We have not seen him since last season. I miss the actor.
Fingers crossed that he at least makes some sort of an appearance before the end. Not easy to do, considering he is dead in both worlds, and smokey can't be him no more?


@35. Posted by: Crispy Seaplanes
re: the whispers

I agree with you and August Paul - it's like they checked off something from a list of things to explain before the end. Perhaps they will still flesh this out - ie why sometimes we hear them, and sometimes we don't?


@41. Posted by: Grace
re: Am I the only one that applauded when Des ran over Locke

Grace - by chance, do you drive?
Ummmmm - Fingers crossed that someone doesn't tick you off! ;)
Kidding here!
I dunno - I felt sad. This was the seemingly good Johnny Locke.
It's not like he was the one who pushed Dez into a well - or Was he?
Bum-Bum-Buuuuuuuuuuum!


@44. Posted by: dk
re: "Wake them up"

LoL! Grace might beg to differ!
Assuming Dez knows all, perhaps he's figured out that [Jack + Locke = true love], and the hospital would be the only way to get them back together?


@49. Posted by: lostguru
re: Desmond would have kissed Lock

Nothing like some homo-errotic Lost fantasies! It would be pretty funny if the LOVE theme were to be found in relationships we never suspected existed!

@53. Posted by: Other Kate
re: twins

Interesting. This could be support for the Jacob/MIB being two sides of the same coin....

#58. Posted by: shikotee at April 14, 2010 9:22 AM

Clicking my name might help explain why Ilana went KABOOM!!!

#59. Posted by: shikotee at April 14, 2010 9:28 AM

Oh, I forgot some things:

1. Why does everyone call him the Man in Black? Certainly the dead people know his name. Why do they call him that when he's no longer wearing a black shirt as Locke? Is he just like the man with the yellow hat?

2. Is the island the crazy mother? It seems that the island is conscious and is bending things to it's will. Crazy?

3. Isn't the FDW at the bottom of the well? Couldn't Des leave that way just like Locke?

4. Des is totally playing by his own rules and I LOVED seeing it rattle Flocke!

5. Why is it so important that the Ajira plane not be destroyed? Do they have to DECIDE to not get on vs. not having the choice?

that's it for now.

namaste.

#60. Posted by: OtherKate at April 14, 2010 9:28 AM

So... I was just looking uop the significance of the number 42 (which there is plenty of). So, I am on the wikipedia page for the number 42 at my desk at work, as I sit there reading about the number, a piece of paper comes flying out of the air duct, and lands on my desk. Its an old label (probably from inside the ductwork), but almost all the print has completely faded. The only clear and legible marking on the paper.... the number 42. creepy!

#61. Posted by: Kevoon at April 14, 2010 9:28 AM

And, some more fun with the Sun/Jin reunion....

#62. Posted by: shikotee at April 14, 2010 9:30 AM

@MAC

I too appreciated the "Human Fund" homage to George Costanza.

Another Seinfeld shout-out from last night was Libby's doctor (Dr. Brooks I think) who happened to be the head of the "Susan Ross Foundation."

Another great episode - the foot is clearly on the gas as we head towards the end of the season.

#63. Posted by: Egyptian Magician at April 14, 2010 9:35 AM

Mac, thanks for another entertaining recap.

And, fyi, (as Data would say) - the website is still 'not operating within normal parameters'!

#64. Posted by: JT at April 14, 2010 9:38 AM

@60. Posted by: OtherKate

1. Why does everyone call him the Man in Black?

This could also support the two sides of the same coin theory. He does not have another name because he is the darker side of Jacob.


2. Is the island the crazy mother?

It still seems plausible and possible that there could be another power at work. I totally still think mama bear is da one!


3. Isn't the FDW at the bottom of the well?

I think we are to believe that this is a different well. The way I read into this is that during ancient times, they dug wells in all the areas on the island (as marked on the Dharma map) that had EM activity. In normal time, the frozen donkey wheel well has been burried, and the Orchid station was built instead.

4. Des is totally playing by his own rules and I LOVED seeing it rattle Flocke!

Totally. No fear Desmond is awesome!
I wonder if fear is needed for smokey to be able to kill?


5. Why is it so important that the Ajira plane not be destroyed?

Flocke seems to imply that all he really needs to do is get everyone (important) back on that plane to be able to leave the island. Perhaps he doesn't even have to fly it?

#65. Posted by: shikotee at April 14, 2010 9:41 AM

I have two theories about why Desmond ran over Sideways-Locke:

(a) It's been established (I think) that either a near-death experience or TRUE LOVE will awaken the sleeper within the Losties and help them remember the alternate timeline. It's possible, since Locke is already with his true love in Sideways-world, that Desmond needed to provide him with a near-death experience in order to awaken him.

(b) I've wondered if Sideways-Locke is really MIB. Think about it: Imprisoned on an island in smoke-form for generations, MIB just wants to live a human life and eat and drink and make love. So he "escapes" the island, and -- since he's sort of "melded" with dead-Locke, he takes over Locke's Sideways-World life. That's why Sideways-Locke is so "zen" about everything: if you were a smoke monster for hundreds of years, wouldn't you just love your life -- even if you were confined to a wheel chair? Hmmmmm.

#66. Posted by: DC-Matt at April 14, 2010 9:45 AM

@Kevoon: I think the island is done with you. Run. Fast. ;)

#67. Posted by: mac at April 14, 2010 9:49 AM

GRAA Mac!

First time poster, long, long time reader.

@44 dk "And you don't ram your car into anyone at that speed to "Wake them up" - you do that to kill them."

Exactly! I think he meant to kill Locke. I think the timelines will eventually intersect or come together. Since Flocke can no longer claim anymore bodily forms (per Ilana) he can only exist off the island as the good John Locke? Maybe Des ran down the real JL to take away the opportunity of Flocke leaving the island thereby keeping him trapped? I do believe Des knows more than Flocke does at this point.

Also, I'm not sure why Flocke would be mad at a younger version of himself. I think he was seeing young Jacob again and that's why he was annoyed.

Finally, just wondering if the Jack and Claire reunion next week will finally bring Claire back to the sunny and bright person she was or if it will push her farther down the dark path?

Thanks to all the posters for your insights. It always makes the Lost experience last just a little longer. Mac don't know what I will do without you once it's finally over!

#68. Posted by: Lost4ever at April 14, 2010 9:50 AM

@ 66 part (a) - Sounds good. I like it.

And why wasn't Jin in the mix at the Flock Camp? I thought he was there. Or is he just hanging in the background. Or is it because we needed the Jack / Flocke stare to be the dramatic scene?

#69. Posted by: dk at April 14, 2010 9:57 AM

@dk #69...Jin is with Widomore.

#70. Posted by: lost2theworld at April 14, 2010 9:59 AM

@69. Posted by: dk

Jin is with Widmore....

#71. Posted by: shikotee at April 14, 2010 10:00 AM

Widomore...that is a new-o char-o-cter-o

OOPS!

#72. Posted by: lost2theworld at April 14, 2010 10:01 AM

I really liked the line by Hurley, "she's good enough for a fajita field trip".

#73. Posted by: brooklyn bum at April 14, 2010 10:06 AM

Folks, there is plenty of room on the Dead Bandwagon!

The whispers being trapped souls in limbo makes sense if the island is a weigh-station terminal between the living world and the afterlife realms.

We saw last night the THIRD new jungle child this season: blond boy, a dark haired dark skinned boy in the temple, and now a light skinned dark haired boy in the jungle. This continues my previous discussion of there being another group of island residents besides the Others.

Flocke's reference to what the island is as being one of the electromagnetic centers on the planet that makes compasses go haywire is reference to Bermuda triangle lore; even through the coordinates for the Pacific anomaly are different that the island's location, the Pacific triangle is called "the Devil's Triangle."

Libby's deep connection to sideways Hugo is what she called "soul mates" from a different place . . . which will lead to a later discussion on multiple after lives.

#74. Posted by: welh at April 14, 2010 10:07 AM

Do you the writers had any humor intended with Jack’s response to Hurley, saying ‘go with your gut’?

#75. Posted by: JT at April 14, 2010 10:16 AM

Ilana blowing up was the first really predictable scene I remember. She even acted like she hated what was about to happen to her character. That was awesome, lol.

I was so hoping to hear Hurley reveal the answer to Richards question: Ask Jacob WHAT the island is.

I don't think Michael was feeling remorse for his killings, but rather feeling bad that he had to mislead Hurley.

#76. Posted by: 74 aka Steve at April 14, 2010 10:22 AM

I don't think Desmond is playing cupid for the sake of playing cupid. I think he is trying to bring sideways-world Losties in contact with people they need to touch, so that they can remember/be awakened to the Lost world.

Will a dead sideways world Locke affect Flocke? OR, will it awaken sideways world Locke to the Lost world? Hmmmmm ...

#77. Posted by: Walker at April 14, 2010 10:24 AM

@38, opserc: "I thought the bag that Hurley picked up contains Jacob's ashes"

That makes a lot of sense. I thought it was Miles' bag of diamonds. I couldn't figure out how that played any role. Thanks!


@49, lostguru: "It would have been so much better if Desmond would have kissed Lock to wake him up to his island experience."

Lol!


@52, Artz Vandelay: "I thought in previous seasons the whispers always seemed to preceed Others sightings (although I could be remembering wrong)."

Yeah, pretty much I think. And this season I believe we've heard them before MIB's arrival.

"Didn't Shannon hear the whispers when she was ghost walt? Weren't they speaking backwards?"

I think she did. Not sure about the speaking backwards part. Walt was speaking backwards, but I don't remember if the whispers were. Last week (or was it the week before) I posted a link to the Lostpedia page with the transcripts of the whispers.

#78. Posted by: Plain Simple at April 14, 2010 10:25 AM

Looooong time lurker, first time poster! I just wanted to comment on the Springsteen references in this ep. Clearly, SOMEONE is a fan. Hurley was supposed to meet "Rosalita" at a place called "Spanish Johnny's". Rosalita is a Boss favorite, usually played during an encore, and Spanish Johnny is a character from Incident on 57th Street (my personal favorite song by The Boss!). Both of these songs are back to back, tracks 6 & 5, respectively on The Wild, the Innocent, & the E Street Shuffle, AND both of them reference dynamite! Google the lyrics - there are references to "paradise" and "lost souls." I literally squealed with delight at my recognition, since I usually don't get the references very quickly. Which is why I come here. Just wanted to share my nerdiness and my 2 favorite things together in one place! GRAA, Mac!

#79. Posted by: Delaney at April 14, 2010 10:27 AM

Why wasn't "I can't die" Richard the one carrying the dynamite? Duh people, use your gifts to your advantage! Also, why didn't Ilana and why doesn't Richard, just educate everyone about what's going on in stead of talking in cryptic messages such as "if that thing leaves the island, we're all dead". Why? How? Who/what is that thing? What is the island? Why don't these people as questions???

Did Desmond know that Locke was dead? If so, why is he pretending he doesn't know Locke's body is now occupied by MIB? Did Flocke throw Desmond in the well to capture him so that he can let Sayid kill him since he cannot do it himself? If so, why didn't he just order Sayid to kill Des when he was tied up? Did Des give Flock some new insight during their walk to the well that suddenly put him on the hit list?

Perhaps Desmond ran Locke over because he knows that MIB finally does leave the island as Flocke and he has to eliminate him. Maybe dead is dead when Locke died. But then that doesn't explain Libby or Charlotte or Faraday still alive in alt timeline. Plus Locke seems like the normal Locke and with Helen, so it can't be MIB could it?

#80. Posted by: BEMH at April 14, 2010 10:28 AM

hey... remember when faraday was crying - was that part of the alt time line perhaps? (cause he was having those flashes)

#81. Posted by: lostatwork at April 14, 2010 10:30 AM

GRAA Mac! You're just a damn good and very entertaining writer. Gonna miss these recaps dangnabbit.

I loved how Ilana blew herself up. She was so self-righteous (I've been training my whole life for this...to protect you...), then BOOM!

It's funny to me how people always complained about never receiving enough answers, then when we finally DO receive answers (like what the whispers are) they still complain away...! I think the writers knew what the whispers were all along and aren't just making things up now to tidy up the series.

The second I saw the well I knew Flocke was gonna push Dez into it. But I think he's still got more to do on the island so he'll get out somehow.

It's weird seeing Jack take such a backseat story-wise, and watching him as a follower.

I gotta say I can't stand what has happened to Claire's character. I hope Jack tells her he's her 1/2 bro next week and I hope it snaps her out of her grizzly-adams-ness somewhat. And I'm not looking forward to seeing her go ballistic on Kate again...

#82. Posted by: JoePike at April 14, 2010 10:43 AM

Did anyone notice that Libby's doctors name was Dr. Burke?

#43. Posted by: lost2theworld

I didn't notice that but I did get that "I should know this guy" vibe from him. Have we seen him before?

---------------------------------------

I thought that same thing.

#46. Posted by: zup

Me, too.

---------------------------------------

Desmond tells Ben he has a son named Charlie......that pretty much confirms that at least alt Des knows everything.

#51. Posted by: lostsox

Excellent point!!

#83. Posted by: Christin at April 14, 2010 10:44 AM

Dr. Brooks was the name of Libby's doctor. He looks familiar because he is the same doctor that was Hurley's doctor at the mental institute. The doctor that took the picture of Hurley and Dave, to show to Hurley that Dave wasn't in the picture.

#84. Posted by: GFish at April 14, 2010 10:48 AM

Perhaps the boy is the same, and when he is blonde (Jacob) he represents good, and when he is dark haired (MIB) he represents evil. And perhaps, just perhaps, Jacob and MIB are one in the same, struggling between good and evil choices. Kind of like the angel on one shoulder, and the devil on the other.

#85. Posted by: BEMH at April 14, 2010 10:53 AM

#82. Posted by: JoePike

When it comes to the whispers, the explanation just rubbed me the wrong way as is seemed so simplistic and inconsistent with many instances of previous island whispering experiences. I have generally not complained about anything this season and have really enjoyed even the weaker episodes so far, but for some reason the whispers revelation just isn't cutting it for me. Maybe it will turn out that Mike really was MIB or working for MIB and lying to Hurley. Maybe there will end up being some alternate more satisfying expalnation for the whispers yet to come but at this point I'm doubting it.

#86. Posted by: Crispy Seaplanes at April 14, 2010 10:54 AM

OK love the idea that the island is the crazy mother, just love it.

Also agree, Ana is Miles' love in non-crash world (and maybe Miles' spy on plane to watch Sawyer-and how Miles found out about where Sawyer went.)

Some interesting things Mac missed or just didn't discuss.

Miles' pop has his arm, in crash-reality he lost it at time of bomb, thus the bomb was not the thing that changed history.

Is it me or is Flocke becoming more Locke-like as he stays in that form?
And he is as selfish as Jacob, there goes my good/evil thought. Of course he says he has taken him out of the picture, I don't think he said that he killed him. Flocke is truly upset Desmond has no fear, why?

Christan's ghost, we all assume it is Flocke but we see the ghost off island with Jack and on the freighter, Flocke can't do that and I cannot recall Flocke talking other than the Locke form or MIB form.

Mike died on the freighter which was outside the island's influence wasn't it? Or did it move close enough to the island?

Desmond has taken on the Jacob role of changing fate in sideways world. No touching but still looks to move things around.

Dead is not dead, or will Libby die at the same time (90 days or something) as she did in the crash-reality?

Also, love that Ilana blew up. In a sense it is a nod to all the other added characters that were not popular.

Sorry but I laughed!

#87. Posted by: Stock at April 14, 2010 10:57 AM

Regarding dead people on the island, whispers, etc...

What if the dead people are being used as pawns in the MIB/Jacob game? Maybe Jacob or MIB recruit these spirits for their "team" by promising them something when they move on into the afterlife.

So, Christian Shepherd could have been working for Jacob, and Michael could be working for MIB.

Then, when they have made their final "move" - for example Christian telling Michael that the island is done with him, or Michael telling Hurley to blow up the Black Rock - they can move on from purgatory into the afterlife they've been promised by Jacob/MIB.

BTW, by saying "Jacob/MIB" I mean Jacob OR MIB. Not trying to imply that they are the same person.

This doesn't however, explain why others from off-island have appeared - for example, Hurley's friend Dave. Although I don't think he was a real person to begin with - just a figment of Hurley's imagination.

Also, agree with the comments that there is some higher conciousness tied to the island that has left to be revealed.

Ok I'm rambling.

This is just a theory so feel free to poke holes. :)

#88. Posted by: Christin at April 14, 2010 11:06 AM

I was expecting the well to be filled? We know during time jumps that it was filled at one point. So then when and why would it have been dug up again?

#89. Posted by: BEMH at April 14, 2010 11:24 AM

* I meant "higher conciousness that yas YET to be revealed.

Typing to fast. :)

#90. Posted by: Christin at April 14, 2010 11:26 AM

GRAA Mac!

I am satisfied with the whisper explanation being that they are the dead. A few seasons back we distinctly heard Boone whisper. But I don't think they are stuck because they did something "bad". There must be another explanation for their stuckness.

I still think Flocke is gathering all the candidates so it's easier to kill them. I'm thinking his intent is to use Sayid to do the deed. After which Flocke figures Sayid will help him leave the island... because I'm still hanging on to the iddea that MIB cannot leave the island unless someone else "opens" the door for him.

But I also think Sayid is not the puppet Flocke thinks he is; I'm holding out hope that Sayid will get Desmond out of that well.

The dark haired boy is definitely played by the same kid as the blonde boy, or played by the blonde kid's brother because I thought he looked a few years older last night, sort of like from age 12 to age 14. And he smiled at Desmond.


#91. Posted by: undauntid at April 14, 2010 11:26 AM

@89 BEMH about the well.

I got the impression that this was a different well than the one with the Frozen Donkey Wheel. The FDW well was covered up by the Orchid station at some point. (Ben goes down through the Orchid versus Locke going down through the well during the time jumps).

I would guess that there are multiple wells. Dug at different points in time to find / release (?) electromagnetic energy.

I wonder if digging one of these "released" the Smoke Monster.

#92. Posted by: GFish at April 14, 2010 11:29 AM

i agree with #11 erin. it's the same kid. his hair just looked darker maybe cuz he wasn't in the sun

#93. Posted by: Ames at April 14, 2010 11:30 AM

Did anyone else catch this:
Ilana: "..and GOD help us if it ever leaves the island"
Flocke: "that's the only way we're ever getting off this GOD for saken rock"
Flocke: "God knows how long it took them" (referring to digging the well).

the use of God last night just seemed to stick out more to me... thoughts??

#94. Posted by: JT at April 14, 2010 11:36 AM

As to the Michael and the whispers.

Are all the dead people that Hurley sees, people who died on the island?

Then maybe it's not really THE purgatory (waiting to get into heaven after the second coming if your sins are not that great to require an eternity in hell - RC background) but the fact that when they died, they were also alive in a sideways world. And maybe many sideways worlds if the island can cause them to exist. So until there is a decision made about which world or time line is the correct one, their spirit has to remain on the island. To decide whether they are alive or dead. Then they can move on.

The fact that Eko and Michael have committed murder would in my catechism send them to hell, not purgatory.

I think the island is a nexus of time lines. I have not finished the Black Tower series, but isn't that where the BT goes?

#68. Posted by: Lost4ever and #80. Posted by: BEMH
Maybe Des ran down the real JL to take away the opportunity of Flocke leaving the island thereby keeping him trapped? I do believe Des knows more than Flocke does at this point.

I was thinking that too. Could Desmond prevent Flocke from using Locke's body if the island is destoyed and the sideways world is the Time line left?

#82. Posted by: JoePike
The second I saw the well I knew Flocke was gonna push Dez into it.

Me Too!

The boy in the jungle.
I thought that he was Jacob - growing up? he looked older, taller. I have thought this since I first saw him. OTOH those of you posting Jacob and MIB for the 2 is interesting. The Jacob boy looked stern and warned about breaking the rules. The MIB boy looked mischievous with a wicked smile before he ran away. Why they are appearing as children, I don't know. Maybe they died on the island too and are there until the time lines get straightened out.

#95. Posted by: berkyo at April 14, 2010 11:46 AM

@95
Isabella, Richards wife, was speaking to Hurly & she died off the Island.

#96. Posted by: Mozartisnotdeaf at April 14, 2010 11:52 AM

Maybe the corpse in the cave with the White & Blk stones are young Jacob & MIB.

#97. Posted by: Mozartisnotdeaf at April 14, 2010 11:56 AM

Observation and questions all in one. Hurley lies about talking to Jacob. Is this the first time Hurley has lied? I thought Hurley couldn't lie? What does it mean that Hurley is now lying to get people to trust/follow him?

#98. Posted by: Constance at April 14, 2010 12:01 PM

@95
Isabella, Richards wife, was speaking to Hurly & she died off the Island.
#96. Posted by: Mozartisnotdeaf

That is correct. HMMMMM

#92. Posted by: GFish
I wonder if digging one of these "released" the Smoke Monster.

This is an interesting idea.
There were two EM sources. The orchid and the Swan. Not near each other. I think the Orchid was built near to the well? Weren't they at the Orchid and then said Look! The well? And then they foomed and the orchid was gone but the well remained?

Now Widmore's scientist has a map that shows 3 EM sources. Not sure where that is, Need to get my old Blast door map out. Wonder if they form some kind of triangle?

#99. Posted by: berkyo at April 14, 2010 12:02 PM

Can't they just shoot the electronic part in plane, dynamites are really that necessary? And HoW could anyone, especially Lapidus think that the plane can be made to fly although now it just sits in the middle of the jungle anyway?

#100. Posted by: Zynp at April 14, 2010 12:06 PM

@ #97
"Maybe the corpse in the cave with the White & Blk stones are young Jacob & MIB"

One of the bodies is female, which is why Jack named them "Adam and Eve." It would be cool if MIB was female in the flesh before losing his/her body and humanity to "the devil."
When we call the island a kind of way-station for those unable to move on, the Egyptian/Alexandrian structures are there to remind us not to put any particular religious (i.e. judeo-christian) slant on it. The Island has obviously been visited by ancient cultures, each of which has had its own interpretation of what the Island is. I wonder if Jacob has revealed the "cork" analogy to each group of "candidates" and Richard is one example?

Also, I need to complain that the previews/commercials are annoyingly full of spoilers. I wish we hadn't been show Michael before he appeared in the episode to Hurley. Kinda killed what would have been a cool moment.

#101. Posted by: glostover at April 14, 2010 12:22 PM

Did anyone notice the Rock'n'Roll references out of the gate in the episodes first couple of scenes? Leaving the awards ceremony Hugo's mom announced his blind date with ROSALITA. Innocent enough, but where is he to meet her? BAM - at SPANISH JOHNNY'S! Shuffle to the first island scene and when Richard asks Ilana what she's got her answer is FOUR STICKS. Kinda got caught up in the story then - need to rewatch & see if there's more.

BTW, was that John Stossel sitting by Hugo at the award ceremony? ossibly Eloise Hawking applauding across the room?

My Favorite line, from Hurley to Libby on the beach: "It takes a lot of guts to go up to a total stranger and tell them you know them from some bizzaro alternate universe."

#102. Posted by: robinpiney at April 14, 2010 12:34 PM

Sideways world thoughts....

Once again, a character who died on the island is the one who making the regular time connection first. Is this a coincidence.

Another point of interest is that Michael appears to Hurley on island, and explains that he is stuck there, as are various other people (aka the whispers). We did not see Michael in the sideways world. Is it not logical to assume that this is because he is stuck in "purgatory". Could this then mean that the dead people that we see in the sideways world are not "stuck" haunting the island?

#103. Posted by: shikotee at April 14, 2010 12:35 PM

"P" to start 2nd sentence in 2nd paragraph above!

#104. Posted by: robinpiney at April 14, 2010 12:36 PM

Best exchange of the episode:

Hurley:
How's blowing up the plane protecting us?

Ilana :
With that plane gone, that THING won't be able to leave the island.

Hurley:
Yea, well, neither will we, and then we'll be stuck here with it, and it will be angry at us!

#105. Posted by: NotLost at April 14, 2010 12:43 PM

BTW I loved the promo for upcoming weeks with the voiceover of Gene Wilder from Willy Wonka--one of the creepiest scenes I've ever seen in a movie! Not sure what the connection might be but it really created a neat mood for the promo. Maybe its all about MIB trying to get some Dharma chocolate bars in hopes of finding a Golden ticket?

#106. Posted by: Crispy Seaplanes at April 14, 2010 12:47 PM

Desmond is reconnecting everyone with their "constants"

#107. Posted by: BEMH at April 14, 2010 12:51 PM

When Desmond floored it to run over Locke, who looked especially pathetic pushing himself in the wheel chair, there was a close up of Desmond's car's license plate. The close up was intentional--what did the plate say??

#108. Posted by: Jim at April 14, 2010 12:53 PM

When Des sat down with Hugo mid-bucket at Mr Cluck's I noticed as he started asking, "Tell me something..." that there was a flash or glint of light. Kind of a Glenda the Good Witch wand-waving moment, like the veil was lifted from Hugo's eyes, or something.

Interesting how we've perceived Hugo as representing the LOST viewer POV. Seems that Desmond can be interpreted as bringing the LOST writer's POV to the table in this scene.

@84 GFish - Just try and tell us that when Hugo was waiting on Libby in the Rec Room you weren't scanning for Dave!

#109. Posted by: robinpiney at April 14, 2010 12:57 PM

@ #107. Posted by: BEMH
Desmond is reconnecting everyone with their "constants"

Hmm, the only thing he seems to have connected Locke with is the front end of his car.....

#110. Posted by: glostover at April 14, 2010 1:01 PM

@108

Lic Plate Number is "2FAN321". Hard to make out the state or country. Almost looks like "California".

#111. Posted by: dbwebdude at April 14, 2010 1:03 PM

@101
that's riiight.

Did they show Hugo's reflection on this episode?

#112. Posted by: Mozartisnotdeaf at April 14, 2010 1:08 PM

@111 Thanks! I thought it was interesting that they flashed it, especially as earlier thy had removed the BMW logos from the car--probably some sponsorship deal.

ANd why wouldn't Desmond drive at least a 5 series BMW??

#113. Posted by: Jim at April 14, 2010 1:09 PM

@111 California

Which would make sense, because he is in California. Plus, that would eliminate a continiuity error.

#114. Posted by: dbwebdude at April 14, 2010 1:09 PM

@ #98. Constance

Hurley lied to Jack when he took him to the lighthouse. He told him Jacob would be there to get him to go...but he wasn't.

#115. Posted by: HurleysTheOne at April 14, 2010 1:15 PM

@111

This might explain the nummber:

http://www.mentalfloss.com/blogs/archives/23269

Ref #10

#116. Posted by: dwebdude at April 14, 2010 1:19 PM

At Santa Rosa with Libby and Hurley in the rec room, I kept waiting for the guy playing Connect Four to start chanting out the numbers!

#117. Posted by: BEMH at April 14, 2010 1:24 PM

Well, now we know why Hurley was in Australia in the Alt Sideways timeline.

He was introducing his new product line "Outback Roasters". Loved the poster with a picture of him in an Aussie hat and the line... "It's like a walkabout in your mouth. Too funny.

#118. Posted by: dbwebdude at April 14, 2010 1:26 PM

haven't had a full read of comments yet. but i see one person (@106) commented on Willy Wonka. I wouldn't have recognized the song but my husband pointed it out and the wheels started turning. So maybe this is a stretch, but there are some parallels there. With Willy Wonka's book/movie, certain people (choosen via tickets!... like plane tickets?) had the privlege of getting into the top-secret, special candy factory. One by one, we see their weaknesses, character flaws, etc. Not until the end do we find out that the whole trip was a test to find a successor. So the lucky winner is the good-hearted Charlie, whose innocence and genuine love and respect were rewarded. Just some food for thought. I don't remember a lot of previews (or any?) being set to music like that. I'm one of those unfortunate viewers who forgets the details of previous seasons and who misses a lot of the coincidences and connections that are revealed, so thanks Mac for the help and reminders!!

#119. Posted by: sunshine at April 14, 2010 1:28 PM

one more point... why aren't they worried that the MIB will get off the island by using the sub? They haven't talked about destroying that. And dynomite isn't the only way to destroy a plane. In fact it's the stupidest way. Why not light it on fire? Smash the daylights out of the instruments and dismantle everything? There are safer ways to do it!
Why is Jack suddenly faithful to the Jacob vibe? Is he forgetting that this is the same "person" who was watching him via the lighthouse? At the time that really messed with Jack's head and he was super upset. I understand that he is trying to have trust in Hurley but he makes lots of references to following Jacob's instructions and fulfilling his missions.

#120. Posted by: sunshine at April 14, 2010 1:34 PM

@29 Dexterously asked:

>How did Hurley know that Michael killed Lybby and Ana Lucia?

On the season-2 ending cross island trek to 'rescue Walt' Jack confronts Michael (after Michael learns Jack has given him an unloaded gun) an Michael admits everything, including responding to direct questions from Hurley.

+----------

@43 lost2theworld pointed out:

>Did anyone notice that Libby's doctors name was Dr. Burke?

Ooh, good catch. I heard that but failed to catch the significance. --Except somebody else says it was "Brooks".

+------------

@76 74 aka Steve (or was if Scott?)

>I was so hoping to hear Hurley reveal the answer to Richards question: Ask Jacob WHAT the island is.

You, me, and a jillion other Lost fans screaming at the television. My vote: Starship.

+------------

@79 Delaney:

Excellent first post! I'm unfamiliar with Springsteen, so all the references went right by me. All other 'never-posters' jump in now while there's still time.

+----

@100 Zynp Asked

>Can't they just shoot the electronic part in plane, dynamites are really that necessary? And HoW could anyone, especially Lapidus think that the plane can be made to fly although now it just sits in the middle of the jungle anyway?

Break a first stage compressor blade.

Just throw some debris in the engines.

Or into th fuel tanks.

Open one hydraulic line.

Puncture a tire.

Break off a pitot tube, or plug one.

Break the cockpit windows (oops - already done)

Open a fuel drain (with or without match).


Any number of ways to easily disable a modern jetliner, especially one with no repair facilities at all available.

#121. Posted by: Cecil at April 14, 2010 1:37 PM

@100
Don't forget they have a runway now. I forget but who told Ben to build that runway.

Also, I've noticed that there are some of you who find it interesting when Flocke offers his hand to someone sitting down and they don't take it but Desmond did take his hand in last nights episode.

#122. Posted by: BigJmaes at April 14, 2010 1:38 PM

@121 Cecil via @100 Zynp
Forgot exploding underwear.

#123. Posted by: Mozartisnotdeaf at April 14, 2010 1:41 PM

Ilana gets blowed up? After she's all "I'm here to protect you"? After she reaches out to Ben? After Jacob's bedside chat? She'll be back. Oh yeah, she'll be back.

Hurley lies to his friends and goes all Locke-like blowing up the Black rock?

Des "kills" Locke and Flocke "kills" Des? Nice symmetry there.

Flocke is definitely becoming more Locke-like. "Why aren't you afraid?" Des should've said, "Why are you?"

I forgot just how darn cute Libby was/is. Any chance Shannon will be back?

I gotta tell ya...this whole "Let's grab us up some highly unstable dynamite so we can disable the plane because Gawd help us there's simply no other way of disabling an airplane" thing just feels contrived and smells wrong like a Diaper Genie.

Dibs on Hurley's Dinosaur trophy.

Hugo's introduction - courtesy of Miles' dad - sounded a lot like what Alvar Hanso was trying to accomplish with the Dharma Initiative.

And kudos to Delaney in post # 79 for catching the Springsteen references. I figgered there had to be some kind of thing going on there, but not being a Bruce fan they went completely over my head.

#124. Posted by: ransomjackson at April 14, 2010 1:41 PM

Gonna throw out a theory, not sure if it's been written already, but here goes:

When Christian Shephard meets Claire in the jungle back in Season 4....is it possible that it's The Man in Black inhabiting Christian's dead body?

And if that's the case -- MIB must have dead body on island to take physical form -- then that means that Eloise Hawking could be an agent of MIB since she's the one who insisted the Oceanic Six take Locke's body back, coffin and all, to the island.

Just a theory.

#125. Posted by: Rob W at April 14, 2010 1:43 PM

#115. HurleysTheOne

Thanks! I knew there was something else I'd forgotten.
Is our Hurley starting down the path of a bad boy??

#126. Posted by: Constance at April 14, 2010 1:47 PM

@Rob W / #125 -- Mrs. Hawking as an MIB agent ... I like that. And if she's aware of the future, which appears to be a defining characteristic, *and* she's aware that Desmond could screw up MIB's plans, then her repeated attempts at thwarting/admonishing Desmond make a lot more sense.

(Nice to see you in here, btw)

#127. Posted by: mac at April 14, 2010 1:49 PM


@112. Posted by: Mozartisnotdeaf
re: Hugo's reflection

Nothing pops to mind. Does anyone recall if there is a mirror reflection of Hugo in the sideways world?

#128. Posted by: shikotee at April 14, 2010 1:50 PM

Did anyone notice how a well-tailored suit made Hurley look considerably less overweight? (At man-of-the-year award presentation.)

#129. Posted by: MySoulmateDigsLost at April 14, 2010 2:05 PM

@125/Rob W wrote:
Eloise Hawking could be an agent of MIB since she's the one who insisted the Oceanic Six take Locke's body back, coffin and all, to the island.

Or not. I was thinking when Flocke said that just as all the O6 had to be together to "return" to the island, they all had to be together to "leave" the island. That is the logic in Flocke's mind on how to escape.

In the past, there was one way I believe kept Smokey from escaping the island . . . it was the Numbers which contained the EM forces (so Smokey could not attain full power). The Numbers were the magic spell combination lock to keep Smokey in place. Now, I can see the possibility of Smokey getting all the Candidates (which represent The Numbers) to Hydra expecting that his invisible chain to the island be broken, but in a twist of fate, the Numbers activate and "seal" Smokey away forever.


#130. Posted by: welh at April 14, 2010 2:15 PM

The whispers only happen when the Others are lurking nearby.
This part of it wasn't explained at all and I doubt it will be :( It was like the writers said "Oh, we have to explain the whispers, we have no idea what they are about so lets just make it ghosts." They didn't tie it to why they were heard in the particularly context.
When Ben stole Alex he confirmed that the whispers were related to the Others being nearby.

#131. Posted by: Amy at April 14, 2010 2:24 PM

GRAA Mac

Your the one I feel bad for this week. I think its the first time ever I've gone through so many posts and hardly anyone has given you your due :( Well, I thank you Mac.

Along with a couple other posters, I too think there's something to the Mr. Cluck's scene with Hurley and Des. The loudspeaker annouces 41, and Hurley looks up to the ceiling. Then Des's number is 42. That just seemed very poiniant. I don't remember enough about all the numbers to speculate on this significance, but I'm sure some of you out there do...

Man I loved that well scene. Like some others, I just knew Des was going to end up in it, I just didn't know whether it was going to be head first or sideways. Now I thought I heard a splash but can't be sure, so now I've got a week picturing Des in a broked heap in the bottom of a dry well, or endlessly dog-paddling in circles.

(I miss some of my fav posters...red_neck_man, bunnylover, ilovebenlynx.... wwwhhheeerrre arrre you?)

#132. Posted by: tweedle_dee at April 14, 2010 2:35 PM

D'oh, my mistake. Gfish #84 pointed out earlier that Libby's doctor's name was Dr. Brooks, not Dr. Burke. I just checked IMBD and Gfish was right, *sigh*. It would've been so much cooler if he was related to Juliette. Oh, well!

#133. Posted by: lost2theworld at April 14, 2010 2:36 PM

@106 Crispy Seaplanes

I totally agree!!! I thought the Willy Wonka reference was absolutely brilliant!!

It was awesome!

#134. Posted by: gleekful at April 14, 2010 2:53 PM

#102 commented about the "bizarro universe". Another shout-out to Seinfeld.

To JT #94: I also noted the "God" references; too obvious NOT to have meaning, I think.

When the ep was over, "The Time Is Now" flashed across the screen. For what? More answers, I hope.

#135. Posted by: lovelost at April 14, 2010 2:57 PM

#130 - welh

Man, I LOVE that theory!

I too was anxiously awaiting the Hurley mirror moment. Maybe there's a reason he didn't have one? hhhmmmmm

#136. Posted by: tweedle_dee at April 14, 2010 3:01 PM

Great Review.

I remember before this season started, it was stated that Jack and Locke's relationship would reach a climax, and that the various timelines would merge into one linear line. Seems like we're headed in that direction.

Desmond = Key to timelines

Jack/Locke Staredown = Foreshadowing to something undoubtedly awesome.

#137. Posted by: jackondrugs at April 14, 2010 3:10 PM

@ 65
"Flocke seems to imply that all he really needs to do is get everyone (important) back on that plane to be able to leave the island. Perhaps he doesn't even have to fly it?"

Well, Jacob was the island protector and now he's dead. The new island protector is currently on the island, but we don't know which one of the candidates it is. Perhaps it's the presence of the island protector who prevents Flocke from leaving, so he knows if he can get all the candidates to leave, he wil be free?

#138. Posted by: Jo at April 14, 2010 3:30 PM

#89. Posted by: BEMH at April 14, 2010 11:24 AM
I was expecting the well to be filled? We know during time jumps that it was filled at one point. So then when and why would it have been dug up again?


That was because they jumped back in time to before the well was dug.

#139. Posted by: Jade at April 14, 2010 3:51 PM

Correct me if i'm wrong but didn't TPTB say that the island was definitely NOT purgatory? did i miss something?

#140. Posted by: Lumped at April 14, 2010 4:01 PM

So when Desmond was unstuck between 2004 and his past in season 2, and he spoke with Mrs.Hawking, was that in the sideways world? Was he jumping between his regular timeline, and the alt-timeline?

That's the only way I think that when she said something like "if you don't go to the island, then we're all dead". If he doesn't go to the island, and stop pressing the button, and 815 doesn't crash on the island, and losties eventually create the sideways world.

#141. Posted by: Jimmy C.C. at April 14, 2010 4:10 PM

@140. Well, they said the characters we were watching - who were all alive, except Christian, I suppose - were not in purgatory. Clearly they were thematically (= "lost") but not literally. So if it's only the dead characters who go to purgatory, TPTB could be technically correct.

That is, if you care one way or another about what they said, as opposed to what they show.

#142. Posted by: LockeBox at April 14, 2010 4:15 PM

@140. Posted by: Lumped
re: TPTB and purgatory

I think they have been relatively consistent. The island is not a purgatory for everyone who survived the crash of 815, which is the frame of reference in which purgatory was considered. It is only purgatory for certain people.

#143. Posted by: shikotee at April 14, 2010 4:16 PM

@143 So just to clarify - our characters have not been in purgatory. however when they die ("die"?) - i.e. Michael - then they may be in purgatory? not sure that this discusion is even relevant as I think the "visions" of dead people are actually MIB and maybe Jacob trying to get our characters to do the necessary deeds to help their particular needs. I haven't seen any distinction between "real" dead people appearing and embodied apparitions - not sure we've been able to tell.

#144. Posted by: lumped at April 14, 2010 6:08 PM

I think Eloise's motivation is more that if Desmond rectifies the timeline, she will lose her son again. But then again, perhaps that explains her possible allegiance with Smokey McFlocke.

No fear Desmond is awesome... though I wish he played a little less aloof on the island. But of course, he's making up for it in Sideways.

The Willy Wonka parallel along with that music synch was freaking genius.

Desmond rammed Locke to get him to the hospital in front of Jack, not to kill him. From there it all unravels. Definitely setting up for Jack and Locke to take up their respective positions on the island for our denoument.

Sayid's going to make the ultimate sacrifice when the shot clock is winding down. He's the odd man out in Sideways world AND the Island. But his redemption will be spectacular.

#145. Posted by: Hector Savage at April 14, 2010 7:02 PM

ANTIPITMH = Anyone notice the island picture in the mental hospital?

It was a mural

#146. Posted by: Gumbo at April 14, 2010 7:07 PM

#98. Posted by: Constance
What does it mean that Hurley is now lying to get people to trust/follow him?


I had not thought about that. Good point. i dk what it means.....

#141. Posted by: Jimmy C.C.Was he jumping between his regular timeline, and the alt-timeline?

This is also good material to ponder. Maybe it is.

What is all the Springsteen and Willy Wonka stuff? I have to re watch this. I don't remember any of that.

#147. Posted by: berkyo at April 14, 2010 7:18 PM

I have a theory on Eloise I would like to get some feedback on.

MiB had mentioned a crazy mother. I wonder if Eloise is that mother.

A few things struck me as odd with her. Last week, when she was speaking with swDesmond, it seemed like her voice took on a deeper, resonating tone at times, in particular, when she was discussing his being "not ready yet". I don't want to call it a cheesy special effect, but there was definitely some type of sound dubbing effect, or at least it seemed that way. Eloise certainly seems to be more "in the know" than any other character, including Charles Widmore. It also struck me as strange that Chuckie would refer to her as Mrs. Widmore several times, but never as 'my wife'.

Some stories involving mythological pantheons describe the gods as having the attitudes of spoiled children -- an interesting parallel with Wonka World.

I wonder if Eloise is mama god and Jacob and MiB are her spoiled children she "grounded" on this island. Perhaps the unidentified island children are their doppelgangers or sideways Jacob/Mib that bled over onto Wonka Island. The children's warnings of 'the rules' are the rules of intentionally bleeding the altiverses to achieve the end of breaking the grounding/getting off the isle.

#148. Posted by: Gumbo at April 14, 2010 7:26 PM

i remember throwing pennies down a well as achild,
i dont ever remember throwing a scotsman down a well,
would that bring you good luck?
hmm..maybe if you are english i suppose,
anyway great episode again this week,
people listening to hurley for a change,
in so many tv shows & movies we see someone who is overweight or a guy who is very thin being made out as the comic relief to add some kind of variety to the proceedings,
fantastic to see oogo! (as his mother calls him) having his moment where people repect him in both scenarios in this epi.

#149. Posted by: san at April 14, 2010 7:50 PM

"i dont ever remember throwing a scotsman down a well, would that bring you good luck?"


Not if your Smokey...

#150. Posted by: Hector Savage at April 14, 2010 8:10 PM

GRAA Mac! You are awesome!

#80 - I thought the same thing....get Richard to handle the TNT...he can't blow up.....and then when Ilana started getting careless I saw it coming...and when she blew up I laughed. It was like a Wyle E. Coyote moment...hilarious.

I thought Ilana said that Flocke was stuck in the human form he was in now and couldn't change into other human forms.

I wondered what was in the bag Hurley picked up. I first thought it was Jacob's ashes but it kinda clinked...like marbles...not diamonds.

I think MIB wants to get all the candidates together so he can kill them. That's what he told Jacob...that he would keep killing anny replacement. However Jin is still with Widmore at this point.

I remember a pod cast with TPTB that said the Island was not heaven, hell, or purgatory...so all the references lately have not swayed me from that.

The Willy Wonka sound track on the coming episode was funny and intriguing. I like the whole magic ticket idea.

I think Des ran over Locke to give him that near death experience...and I agree with #107 that he may be trying to hook up constants.

...and #117.l..I thought the same thing...I was waiting for the guy in the rec room plying the game to start chanting...4..8..15..16..23..42.

#151. Posted by: So_Lost at April 14, 2010 8:10 PM

@#79delaney
@102robinpiney
I thought the Springsteen references were terrific. As soon as Hurley's mom said Rosalita my wife and I looked at each other and I said awwww Rosalita and left it at that. Then I saw the Spanish Johnny's menu and freaked out. "Those romantic young boys, all they wanna do is fight"

#152. Posted by: monster34 at April 14, 2010 8:18 PM

Re: Desmond replying to Locke that he has a child named Charlie. This is the Desmond that was shot by Ben, kidnapped and brought to the island by Widmore. That Dez would know about having a kid he left behind. I'm not understanding why the Alt-time or SW time Desmond would seem to know about his son.

If I'm misunderstood something, please help me understand.

Thanks all,

#153. Posted by: tesla at April 14, 2010 8:31 PM

read this site a few times... didnt go all the way through the comments so dont know if this got mentioned, but ill say it just in case:

AltDes (we should stop calling him that, he isnt an alternative at all) ahem, the Desmond in the city, is unhinged. Like a pinball. And everything (every losty) he touches in the city, will go off their path. Thats what he did with Hugo that lead to his meeting Libby (gave hugo the oooomph into going on the date leading to seeing Libby) and thats what he just did by hitting Locke. This will lead to Locke in some way making a connection. Next week. Also; he knows they cant die in the city. Not sure why, just yet, but Charlie walked through traffic and attempted drowning to prove the point that they cant die. So Des hit Locke knowing that he was just unhinging him from the path, knowing he wouldnt kill him.

Who else had small interactions with people that ended up changing their life? OOOOHYEAAH Jacob. Desmond is new Jacob? Ill believe it till proven otherwise, but theres too much pointing in that direction. Not that Des knows who or what he is yet. Hes just pure good. Newly born to the world.

#154. Posted by: hey_mikey at April 14, 2010 8:36 PM

"i dont ever remember throwing a scotsman down a well, would that bring you good luck?"

Don't give anyone the wrong idea. We need you around!

By the way, I thought it sounded like rocks or marbles in the bag too. I listened to it several times and it's hard to tell if it's background sound or whatever is in the bag.

#155. Posted by: sandivon at April 14, 2010 8:51 PM

@112 Hugo Reflector & @128 Shikotee

I was watching for a reflection and did not see one either... must make him extra special somehow...

#156. Posted by: lostncyberspace at April 14, 2010 8:56 PM

I like the ideas about Ms Hawking being the mother of MIB and Jacob (and the island ultimately?). :D

Libby mentioned to Hugo that she remembered that discussion in the mental hospital before. I got thinking why had they met there in the first place? (Maybe this got answered, I don't remember). I'm thinking that maybe the explosion from the swan from the end of season 5 caused some crazy time shift again ala Donnie Darko and the first time they met in the hospital was the same as the second. If Desmond is down the same well with the wheel maybe that causes the shift instead?

I'm sure i've probably forgotten some important answers, I need to go watch from the start of the program again. :P

It might be interesting to look over the car accident incidents including Locke in previous episodes. There are quite a few. http://lostpedia.wikia.com/wiki/Car_accidents

#157. Posted by: Sulphent at April 14, 2010 9:13 PM

Anyone with a DVR who recorded this week's episode should review it and pay close attention to the preview of next week's episode. instead of music setting it up there is a scene from Carlie and the Chocolate Factory playing out behind scenes from next week's episode. It referenced the scene in the movie where all of the characters are in a darkened room and all of a sudden Wonka's face appears and starts talking rather ominously. Can some one tell me what this could mean are we headed back to Charles Widmore's version of Wonderland again complete with a permanent vacation in the alternate universe ? If so I'll be sure to have Dark Side of the Moon ready for the commerical breaks in my Ipod.

#158. Posted by: Peter Murray at April 14, 2010 9:18 PM

re@: "i dont ever remember throwing a scotsman down a well, would that bring you good luck?"
--------------
once the well starts to flow you don't get water...... but all the MacCutcheon you can drink.

#159. Posted by: BruthaTosser at April 14, 2010 9:49 PM

@59/Shikotee: I think I'm in love! (and you beat me to it!) That girl loves my shtick!

Why did Desmond's license plate change? Can someone else confirm this?

Maybe Desmond was trying to kill Alt-Locke in order to bring Island Locke back to life in which case Smokey would have to leave his body form? I think both Desmonds either know what each other know or they swapped when the giant magnet got hold of him. That would explain why Island Des was so happy to help Widmore since he was Alt-Widmore's yes/fixit man. And if island Des knows removing Locke's body from the equation will help, then it's Deathrace 2007 for him!

#160. Posted by: PiecesofArzt at April 14, 2010 10:32 PM

@#153. Posted by: tesla
Re: Desmond replying to Locke that he has a child named Charlie.

I didn't re-watch yet, but I thought the Charlie reference was to when Desmond was telling Ben that he was looking for a school for his son, Charlie, before he ran over Locke.

My thought was he used that name because of either Widmore or Charlie

#161. Posted by: 74 aka Steve at April 14, 2010 10:47 PM

@Crispy/13 - I agree, that was a real LOL. BWAAAAHAAAHAAA! You've got a piece of Ilana on you!

@17. Posted by: Silhouette - Why would anyone mourn her? She's been bullying everyone around with a gun?

@98. Posted by: Constance - It's not that Hurley can't lie, it's that he believes lying is wrong & causes more problems. But he obviously thinks it's more important to do what the ghosts tell him than to tell the truth.

@121. Posted by: Cecil - it's not 'never-posters,' it's LTLFTP!

#162. Posted by: hurling at April 14, 2010 11:22 PM

Hey Mac long time lurker,

I was wondering did anyone think that Des hit Locke so that he would have to go see Jack? Remember at the airport Jack gave him is card and he almost called him, but decided to give up hoping to be healed. So I think Locke will end up seeing Jack and Jack will have to save his life thus causing them to have their "cupid" moment, just my thought. Thanks for the wonderful reviews do not know who I will lurk when this is over.

#163. Posted by: Toshnorfair at April 14, 2010 11:46 PM

@99 berkyo pondered:

>Now Widmore's scientist has a map that shows 3 EM sources. Not sure where that is, Need to get my old Blast door map out. Wonder if they form some kind of triangle?

*Any* three points form a triangle. Although a trivial one if they lie on a straight line.

#164. Posted by: Cecil at April 15, 2010 12:05 AM

>"i remember throwing pennies down a well as achild,
i dont ever remember throwing a scotsman down a well,
would that bring you good luck?"

Maybe if he was pinching a penny at the time?

#165. Posted by: Cecil Rose at April 15, 2010 12:08 AM

@66, DC-Matt: Both ideas crossed my mind as well. The first one is the most likely in the sense that it is the most obvious one with last week's episode in mind. But I haven't completely dismissed the second one either.

@82, JoePike: "The second I saw the well I knew Flocke was gonna push Dez into it. But I think he's still got more to do on the island so he'll get out somehow."

Nah, he'll sit out the rest of the show down there. ;)


@83, Christin: "Desmond tells Ben he has a son named Charlie......that pretty much confirms that at least alt Des knows everything.
#51. Posted by: lostsox
Excellent point!!"

So because he knows the name of his son, he knows everything? That's a bit of a leap, isn't it?

@86, Crispy Seaplanes: "When it comes to the whispers, the explanation just rubbed me the wrong way as is seemed so simplistic and inconsistent with many instances of previous island whispering experiences."

Well phrased. I think that summarizes my objections as well, although some previous instances could very well work as the voices of the death. But, as I said in a previous post, the risk of getting answers is that you might not like them. In a lot of stories the writers seem better at posing mysteries than giving answers that are equally probing and intriguing as the mysteries.

@87, Stock: "Miles' pop has his arm, in crash-reality he lost it at time of bomb, thus the bomb was not the thing that changed history."

Interesting observation. I didn't pay attention to his arm. Of course, there still is the possibility within the Lost story that the bomb just screwed up time royally and things all over the place... sorry time... got messed up.

"Is it me or is Flocke becoming more Locke-like as he stays in that form?"

He is. I half expect to see the real John Locke making a come back at the end of the show.


"Also, love that Ilana blew up. In a sense it is a nod to all the other added characters that were not popular."

Exactly. It's not that I minded Ilana very much, but she was just one extra piece taking away time from our beloved main characters. Now she is multiple extra pieces, which shouldn't take up too much screen time anymore. Just after giving the Losties a piece of her mind, she did it again.

@90, Christin: "Typing to fast. :)"

Not eating to fast usually works better. ;) (Sorry, couldn't resist... ... I'm the last person who should point out typos)

@98, Constance: "Observation and questions all in one. Hurley lies about talking to Jacob. Is this the first time Hurley has lied? I thought Hurley couldn't lie? What does it mean that Hurley is now lying to get people to trust/follow him?"

Good point! Hurley is turning into Jacob, i.e. a big (no pun intended) manipulator.

@99, berkyo: "Wonder if they form some kind of triangle?"

Unless the lie on a single line, yes they do.

@106: "Maybe its all about MIB trying to get some Dharma chocolate bars in hopes of finding a Golden ticket?"

We can only hope. :)

@109, robinpiney: "@84 GFish - Just try and tell us that when Hugo was waiting on Libby in the Rec Room you weren't scanning for Dave!"

I know I was.

@118: "Well, now we know why Hurley was in Australia in the Alt Sideways timeline.
He was introducing his new product line "Outback Roasters". Loved the poster with a picture of him in an Aussie hat and the line... "It's like a walkabout in your mouth. Too funny."

You must love this then: http://tinyurl.com/mu3cke

And if you're at it, watch this as well: http://tinyurl.com/y5omcey

#166. Posted by: Plain Simple at April 15, 2010 12:10 AM

I just watched the Lost Untangled episode of Everybody Loves Hugo. These pieces just keep getting funnier and funnier. I loved how they changed to "Dharma film quality" every time flesh&bones Chang was speaking.

#167. Posted by: Plain Simple at April 15, 2010 12:25 AM

@165. Posted by: Cecil Rose - a few of us would rather pinch a Scotsman. ;)

@EVERYONE - Just wanted to let everyone know I closed the Lost forum on Delphi. It wasn't getting any traffic, but a few of you stopped by in the beginning of the season. If you use Delphi for other fora, you have to delete Lost manually from your list.

#168. Posted by: hurling at April 15, 2010 12:43 AM

Great review Mac. Don't know if this has been mentioned already as I have not gone though all the comments, but did anyone else notice the man at the banquet introducing Hurley was Dr. Pierre Chang??? I thought that was interesting.

#169. Posted by: EB at April 15, 2010 12:47 AM

@167 Plain Simple advised:

>I just watched the Lost Untangled episode of Everybody Loves Hugo. These pieces just keep getting funnier and funnier. I loved how they changed to "Dharma film quality" every time flesh&bones Chang was speaking.

Loved f&bChang going all Zoe (24Zoe, not LostZoe) on MuppetChang.

#170. Posted by: Cecil at April 15, 2010 1:08 AM

Jesus #5, spoiler much?

#171. Posted by: Nath at April 15, 2010 4:15 AM

@Nath #171,

I'd have to say anything shown *in the show itself* including previews, are fair game for comment ans speculation, else where's the fun?

If I was that easily spoiled, I's steer clear of blogs altogether.

That said, maybe, erin, a little

*** SPOILER WARNING ***

at the head of the post would be helpful?

Another reason I don't put too much credence in previews, anyway, is that the shows (not just Lost, but many of them) seem try to intentionally mislead in their previews.

#172. Posted by: Cecil at April 15, 2010 5:17 AM

Maybe if he was pinching a penny at the time?

#165. Posted by: Cecil Rose


Or maybe if he was just pinching Penny! ;)

#173. Posted by: Crispy Seaplanes at April 15, 2010 6:57 AM

#169:

“Don't know if this has been mentioned already as I have not gone though all the comments, but did anyone else notice . . . “

Of ALL the words
constructed
into ALL the sentences
ever written
since the BEGINNING of time
as we know it
I can only HOPE that when
season six in concluded
that if I EVER hear
these words again
or even see them inscribed
I will probably scream
so long and hard
that my head
will
EXPLODE.

Perhaps you should all stand back.

#174. Posted by: davidrh at April 15, 2010 8:32 AM

#174. Posted by: davidrh

Be careful or they might use you to blow up the Ajira plane

#175. Posted by: Crispy Seaplanes at April 15, 2010 8:37 AM

Lost Untangled is hilarious!
Double Channnngggg...... Don't tase me bro!

#176. Posted by: Puck at April 15, 2010 8:45 AM

Anyone notice how Locke always offers an open hand when he asks anyone to come with him or get up? Most like Kate and Sun don't take it, but Desmond did. I think there is something to this,Iike jacob's touching the candidates when they were unaware. The touch with Locke needs to be of your own free will.

#177. Posted by: Marc at April 15, 2010 9:22 AM

Great episode..Sawyer was able to see the kid and so does Desmond. I beleive MIB understood that Des was a candidate and he could not be killed(the kid shows up to remind him that)..therefore he ditches him to into the well instead of killing him. Candidate with special skills to evade EM energy makes Des the most likely Jacob successor (probably the sacrifice Widmore was mentioning)

#178. Posted by: Jag at April 15, 2010 9:28 AM

Berkyo said "but the fact that when they died, they were also alive in a sideways world. And maybe many sideways worlds if the island can cause them to exist. So until there is a decision made about which world or time line is the correct one, their spirit has to remain on the island."

I was thinking along the same lines...that the whisperers are somehow out of sync with the alternate time lines. But, We haven't seen Michael in the alt timeline and we have seen Boone there but we have heard Boone whisper on the island. I don't know! But some thing tells me they are stuck because they are out of sync in some way.

#179. Posted by: undauntid at April 15, 2010 9:54 AM

Just a reminder, Libby, Locke, Boone, Shannon, etc. that are alive in sideways world were still alive in crash-reality during the time periods were are watching sideways take place (maybe less than a week after the crash happened 2004.)

While I am not saying they are going to die in sideways world, I am just pointing out that we can't take it as a fact they don't.

Mike also has the Walt problem in his sideways, since Walt is 6 years older. But I think his accident that stopped him from taking Walt as a baby may have been caused by Jacob.

#180. Posted by: Stock at April 15, 2010 10:12 AM

#148. Posted by: Gumbo
I like your theory a lot. But we see her on the island in the 1940's. Are you thinking she was there earlier too? And what about Faraday? Would he be their brother?

I mentioned the MYST games before where a man created worlds by writing books and then he could visit them when he wanted to. He had 2 sons who became evil and each took worlds and ruined them. The gamer has to find out what went wrong and fix it and eventually track down the sons. Ecology, science, environment and morals. In a later game the father imprisons his sons each on a different world. They are trying to escape and the gamer has to stop them before they ruin more worlds...

#164. Posted by: Cecil
*Any* three points form a triangle. Although a trivial one if they lie on a straight line.

LOL, Yes they do! I meant a special one that would be a clue to something fantastic that no one has found yet lol......or something like that.

I was asking my husband the other day about the pockets of liquid gas in the ground around here. LOL sometimes I think I am related to Yogi Berra.

#181. Posted by: berkyo at April 15, 2010 10:25 AM

#174. davidrh:

I thoroughly agree. People commenting on stuff that they haven't read/understand has pretty much ruined the blog for me.

GRAA, Mac! : )

#182. Posted by: Alaïs_Longthought at April 15, 2010 10:35 AM

I don't think Ilana's bag (that Hugo took after Ilana was arzt-ed) contains Jacob's ashes. It seemed to have some "heft" to it. As though there was something with weight in it.

#183. Posted by: undauntid at April 15, 2010 10:39 AM

No mention of Hurley's shoutout to the Alternate Universe. That line was directed right at us. Even though we've been calling it that all along, they finally admit on the show that it is an alternate universe.

I love that theory mentioned above about the 6 being a lock combo. When the original 6 left, Lock didn't leave, claire did. Locke was always on his own, so what Sawyer so they never were able to get them all together at once for a long period of time. I think Locke is going to realize that SUN is not the 6th combo but Jin is. He will have to wait until they bring Jin back before he can use the 6 to unlock himself. Get it? He chose someone named Locke, because he is locked and now will unlock himself.

Desmond definitely hit John to free his mind from MIB locke. John did not have a love interest on the island so that angle wouldn't work for him.

#184. Posted by: ALEX ANGEL at April 15, 2010 11:00 AM

Last we saw, Desmond lies at the bottom of the well. If I remember correctly, the statue was visible from the well. If what lies in the shadow of the statue, is as Richard put it, The One Who Will Save Us All, Could Desmond be what lies in shadow of the staue?

#185. Posted by: Revelation at April 15, 2010 11:09 AM

@137, jackondrugs: "I remember before this season started, it was stated that Jack and Locke's relationship would reach a climax, and that the various timelines would merge into one linear line. Seems like we're headed in that direction."

Are you sure about that? Before the start of the current season there was only one timeline on the show (unless we were shown scenes from other timelines without being told so), so the comment about "various timelines" seems out of place. Or out of time at least.


@144, lumped: "not sure that this discusion is even relevant as I think the "visions" of dead people are actually MIB and maybe Jacob trying to get our characters to do the necessary deeds to help their particular needs. I haven't seen any distinction between "real" dead people appearing and embodied apparitions - not sure we've been able to tell."

Exactly. I have a feeling TPTB will leave the ultimate interpretation of all these things up in the air. If you want to believe these are death people, you can, if you think it's MIB and Jacob playing their mind games, you can as well. Think about it, the "answer" we got was delivered by a death dude to a crazy guy. Ambiguous much? What a great way for the writers to pretend to give us answers. And if they're ever called on some apparent inconsistency they can go the denial route and chalk it up to our interpretations instead of what was actually shown.


@154, hey_mikey: "AltDes (we should stop calling him that, he isnt an alternative at all"

I sometimes use ALT for Another Lost Timeline. ;)


"Who else had small interactions with people that ended up changing their life? OOOOHYEAAH Jacob. Desmond is new Jacob? Ill believe it till proven otherwise, but theres too much pointing in that direction. Not that Des knows who or what he is yet. Hes just pure good. Newly born to the world."

I like the way you're thinking. And what's the title for the upcoming episode again...?

@155, sandivon: "By the way, I thought it sounded like rocks or marbles in the bag too. I listened to it several times and it's hard to tell if it's background sound or whatever is in the bag."

Like black and white rocks?

163, "Toshnorfair: "I was wondering did anyone think that Des hit Locke so that he would have to go see Jack?"

That would be a big gamble. Surely there are more doctors in LA, even ALT!LA, then just Jack. Even more hospital's than just Jack's.


@170, Cecil: "Loved f&bChang going all Zoe (24Zoe, not LostZoe) on MuppetChang."

Zoe... Zoe... sounds familiar, but haven't seen 24 in a while. I can't find her on IMDB either. Who was she again?

@173, Crispy Seaplanes: "Or maybe if he was just pinching Penny! ;)"

He did fall for her.

#186. Posted by: Plain Simple at April 15, 2010 11:31 AM

Can't do much posting these two weeks as I must catch spare moments at the public library for an internet connection. Will copy the posts and read them later. But I honestly would have preferred if the whispers turned out to be wind blowing through a special sort of tree that only grew on this island. It would not be beyond belief that this island which has supposedly been around since the formation of the earth, maybe broke off from some land mass once, still had independently evolved species plus normal things picked up in its travels. It would have angered the fans, but it would have had an element of humor that would have made me forgive them. After all the speculation, it is only a weird sound effect of the branch and leaf structure of this one particular tree. Note that there always has to be wind before we hear the voices. But that's why they pay those guys big bucks.

#187. Posted by: August Paul at April 15, 2010 11:35 AM

186 Plain Simple asked:

>@170, Cecil: "Loved f&bChang going all Zoe (24Zoe, not LostZoe) on MuppetChang."

>Zoe... Zoe... sounds familiar, but but haven't seen 24 in a while. I can't find her on IMDB either. Who was she again?

My bad. On 24 it's *Chloe*, not Zoe. Jack's #1 friend and computer whiz, famous for having tased a guy in a bar unconscious when he was hitting on her while she was trying to aave the world (or at least Jack Bauer) from her laptop.

Come to think of it, 24Zoe's not a bad hand with a taser, either. But she doesn't have the Chloe pout.

Click my name for a pic of Chloe.

#188. Posted by: Cecil at April 15, 2010 11:48 AM

Why does Jacob need a replacement, and if he really does, why does it matter who the candidates are?–
What makes them candidates?
Why had Jacob not picked one before he let himself be killed? – Obviously Jacob does not choose the replacement.
If Jacob does not pick the replacement perhaps MIB chooses the gatekeeper, he just doesn’t know it. Or does he

Possible answer:

The first one, who willingly accepts that they will replace Jacob, will be the replacement. The last one standing may have to be the one. If that person does not willingly take the job, it all starts over again , until the end. Remember… It only ends once…

#189. Posted by: Revelation at April 15, 2010 11:57 AM

Why Illana was able to blow herself up is still a little baffling. She was supposed to have more to do because she was protecting the “Candidates”.

I wonder… Did Christian appear to her just before the explosion and tell her that “she could go now”?

Maybe she is now back in the Alt world lying in a hospital from the blast,all bandaged up and broken, and Jacob will soon come to visit and apologies that it took him so long to come see her.

#190. Posted by: Revelation at April 15, 2010 12:05 PM

Maybe she is now back in the Alt world lying in a hospital from the blast,all bandaged up and broken, and Jacob will soon come to visit and apologies that it took him so long to come see her.


#190. Posted by: Revelation

I was thinking along those same lines, but I think it would be an incredible stretch that she lived when she was standing next to 4 sticks of dynamite. Remember pieces of Arzt?? Now we have to be picking off IIyana too.

...I mean, really, next you'll be expecting us to believe in alternate worlds, dead guys talking, people jumping back in forth in time...

#191. Posted by: sandivon at April 15, 2010 12:21 PM

@191 Sadivone wrote:
"I mean, really, next you'll be expecting us to believe in alternate worlds, dead guys talking, people jumping back in forth in time...
"

You believed that a columnd of flashing smoke cood take the form of a dead looser... Why not some other unexplainable scenario. After all it is television.

#192. Posted by: Revelation at April 15, 2010 12:25 PM

Hurleys bag had the black and white stones that was taken from the Adam and Even skeletons a while back.

#193. Posted by: ALEX ANGEL at April 15, 2010 12:45 PM

#159 BruthaTosser

lololololol
snort snort

#169 davidrh

I quoted it all because it bare's repeating and repeating and repeating and repeating and repeating......
Thank you David

Ok, so if Eloise is the Big Momma of the two "nasty boys" and the island, then she has a time affliction of non-aging just like Richard. That would mean she's not the be-all of the island because someone cursed her. Yes? No?

#194. Posted by: tweedle_dee at April 15, 2010 1:11 PM

Locke's lost love is the island.

#195. Posted by: Skulley at April 15, 2010 1:29 PM

Here I try again, and shall repeat courtesy of davidrh

“Don't know if this has been mentioned already as I have not gone though all the comments, but did anyone else notice . . . “

Of ALL the words
constructed
into ALL the sentences
ever written
since the BEGINNING of time
as we know it
I can only HOPE that when
season six in concluded
that if I EVER hear
these words again
or even see them inscribed
I will probably scream
so long and hard
that my head
will
EXPLODE.

Perhaps you should all stand back

#196. Posted by: tweedle_dee at April 15, 2010 1:42 PM

How many of you were expecting Locke to just stand up after he got hit by Des? I don't know if that's too much leakage, but I totally thought that was going to happen.

And how creepy that the finale is on May 23 which is jack's number?

#197. Posted by: Cheese at April 15, 2010 1:58 PM

On Jorge Garcia's podcast GeronimoJacksBeard for the latest episode 'Everybody Loves Hugo", he mentions that Grandpa Tito (whis is apparently also a special effects man on the show) makes a cameo appearance.

I didn't catch that, did anybody? Banquet scene maybe? Apparently lucky alternate Hugo didn't lose his Grandpa at his first press conference.

#198. Posted by: Cecil Rose at April 15, 2010 2:05 PM

* * * * Long Post Warning * * * *

Sorry Mac, posted earlier without the GRAA that too many of us take for granted. We will truly miss your efficient insight and humorful approach to the subject at hand week after week!

@174,davidrh - The infrequency of my posts is in direct proportion to my through perusal (if not actual digestion) of pre-existing posts before I comment. And I'm sure there are many more of us out there :)

@119, Sunshine, et al - Thought the Wonka spot was provocative, the best since the pre-6th season chessboard one. You're dead on relating the similarites to WW&TCF and LOST. I feel if we take your theory and apply it to the candidates that Hugo is The Man, if indeed a Jacob replacement is the goal.

I like how LOST acts as a pop culture magnet (pun intended), both with the writers' construction of the narrative and our deconstruction of it. The Stand (and other Steven King books), Eastern and Western religions, Seinfeld, Fast Food franchises, Robinson Crusoe, scientific cults, many science fiction classics, even Bruce Springsteen all figure into the mix. Has there ever been another series with such a well-considered architechture?

@132,tweedle_dee - I'd missed that Des had order #42. Kwon(Sun? Jin? Ji Yeon?), the only candidate still ambiguous, is 42 on the lighthouse wheel and the cave wall. I think there's a lot to this scene. Neither Hugo nor Desmond have had a mirror encounter (unless you want to count Hugo in on Jack's lighthouse smash-up.) And they both seem to be the two most "pure" of the canditates. Theories?

@130, welh - Don't know if any of you've compiled statistics, but my money's on welh for the most consistently realized theorist on this blog. And this is another good one! The Numbers, or the people they represent, are a combination lock to keep Smokey captive. This, rather than replacing Jacob, could well be the goal of all that has occurred. Again, #42 is the wild card: If Flocke picks the "wrong" Kwon and gets all the other numbers in place at the Hydra is he free once and for all?

@154,hey_mikey, @177,marc - Desmond has always been different. He got to the island on his own, had been there three years keeping the world from ending before the 815'ers crashed. It seems to me with this episode his purpose again has become elevated over "just" replacing Jacob or MIB. We have not actually been informed what these numbered people are candidates for, have we?

Finally, on a lighter note:

@168, Plain Simple - LOST Untangled is great! I've been a Muppet fan since the B&W Kerns Bread "I used to love my raincoat" commercials of my youth. Muppet Chang is uniquely qualified to comment on the suspend-your-disbelief nature of LOST. And I love how he'll projectile-puke on the floor at the slightest unpleasantry - F&B Chang no doubt needs new shoes!

#199. Posted by: robinpiney at April 15, 2010 2:59 PM

If you can see the main Island from Hydra, wouldn't two dynamite blasts be heard by the people on Hydra? It seems there should have been some kind of echo.

Just got this link from a friend:
"Times Talks Live: LOST" May 20

http://tiny.cc/ddszh


#200. Posted by: lovelost at April 15, 2010 3:04 PM

Ask Jacob what the Island is? Says Richard to Hurley. Is this the story Jacob told him about the island being a cork that holds in evil? Or is there something else we don't know about?
Why does it seem that Eloise and Widmore know the whole truth...or so it seems. And they are playing Desmond like a puppet...and others. Because in the altuniverse their son lives?
Flocke seems to be unraveling or losing a grip. Desmond's enchanted attitude and Sayid's zombie compliance have really shown great acting. Just hope they remember their friendship from the freighter days and overtake Flocke. I want Sayid to snap out of it.
What will happen when Ben sees Widmore again? Ben wanted to kill his daughter to revenge his own daughter.

I hope someone writes a book about this stuff.

#201. Posted by: sueblue at April 15, 2010 4:06 PM

@201. Posted by: sueblue
"Desmond's enchanted attitude and Sayid's zombie compliance have really shown great acting. Just hope they remember their friendship from the freighter days and overtake Flocke. I want Sayid to snap out of it."

I believe Sayid is snapping out of it. And here is why IMO:

Sayid did not volunteer of his own free will to be one of the minions. He was baptized in the temple pool without consent, much like Ben was. Ben seems to have been able to overcome the brutally dispassionate walking dead mentality of the others, and I believe Sayid will overcome this as well. He mentioned to Flock that he felt nothing, yet when given the opportunity to kill Widmore’s right hand girl, he tells her to run instead. I believe that Sayid is exercising the one thing evil cannot usurp, his freewill. He is aware of the possession, and did not consent. His lack of Consent is a violation of the rules, so he is free to reject the infection. When he does, he will be a force to be reckoned with, and perhaps a formidable foe against the evil that tried to illegally recruit him. Once he overcomes the evil inside, he will be immune.

#202. Posted by: Revelation at April 15, 2010 4:13 PM

@199 robinpiney: do we know for sure that desmond got to the island "all on his own"??

#203. Posted by: tiffani at April 15, 2010 4:22 PM

One last submittal for today for comments and rebuttal folks

Theory Alert!!!

I still think about the replacement(s) for Jacob/MIB. If Jacob and MIB are two sides of the same coin, symbolically attached to each other, does their replacement have to be a pair? Two people, not one. With such emphasis on soul mates in the series, and the white/black, ying/yang theme, this could be a viable solution. To extrapolate on this idea of a pair, I look at the possibility of the island being or encompassing the birthplace of man . “Adam and Eve” are chosen and the story begins. Mankind goes forth, and is then called home to be tested. They come, they conquer, they corrupt, and they destroy. It always has ended the same. Adam and eve are selected from a group of candidates and they try again. It only ends once, everything else is just progress. How many times has this played out? This time, One pair on the island did not do any of the things that mankind has done. Rose and Bernard adapted, became part of their new world, and accepted the island for what it had to offer as a home. Finally a witness to the redemption of man, and it in this case, it did not end the same way. what follows is the finale.

#204. Posted by: Revelation at April 15, 2010 5:22 PM

@robinpiney #199...Neither Hugo nor Desmond have had a mirror encounter

Des had two last week, IIRC.


@davidrh #174

I concur. It makes me sad.

#205. Posted by: lost2theworld at April 15, 2010 5:32 PM

And I had Ilana pegged as Jacob's replacement! Ever since she gave Ben the long considered look and then said, "I'll have you" she has been a favorite of mine. I guess I am a sucker for forgiveness and redemption.

Can someone remind me why we think the candidates are candidates to be Jacob's replacement? Did Jacob or Richard or Ilana ever say that? Maybe they were candidates to be the annual human sacrifice? Or the candidate to compete in the annual Island Games?

I've heard that the last episode will be preceded by a two hour recap. Does anyone else think that the writers might use this as a way of "explaining" all the little things that have bothered viewers but which they didn't want to waste an episode explaining?

I am opposed to the notion that dead Christian is really MIB becuase he, dead Christian, appeared to Jack back in the hospital during the Oceanic Six's return to LA. MIB can't get off the island. Maybe Jack has a little bit of Hurley's ghost talking abilities, but I don't believe this either. There is, I believe, a still significant point to Christian's missing body in Altverse.

No one buying my notion that jungle boy is the same boy, just aging quickly? Gotta grow up in time to stop MIB in destroying the universe. The opposite of the big bang being the big suck?

Little reminder. Hurley talks to dead people no one else can see. Dr. Brooks shows Hurley that David isn't real. Libby says her husband David is dead when she gives Desmond her boat.

Time for me to drive around to find a hot spot to post this stuff. And I am only at 90 in my reading of the posts that I copied this morning. Granted, I haven't spent the day reading them.

#206. Posted by: August Paul at April 15, 2010 5:50 PM

@203, tiffini - Yes, I left Des's island arrival too open to interpretation, didn't I? He got to the island independent of any other group.

@205, lost2theworld - Oops! Hugo is still reflection-free, I think!? Des is set apart from the others that've been drawn to the island, IMO.

What if the candidacy is to be sacrificed? How does that change your opinion?

#207. Posted by: robinpiney at April 15, 2010 5:58 PM

There once a Chicken czar from Tustin, whose philantrophy efforts were a bustin.

And then one day, in an unusual way, a Scotsman said give up the bucket and go %#&* it.


((go date it))

#208. Posted by: Siobahn Lass at April 15, 2010 7:32 PM

@208. Posted by: Siobahn
"Chicken czar from Tustin,"

I like it!!! but, John Locke was from Tustin, Not Hugo.

@195. Posted by: Skulley
"Locke's lost love is the island."

IMO, Locke loves nothing... He is dead and gone.

Any one wanna talk about 189, 202, or 204. or do we stick with reflections of Lost characters in the looking glass?

#209. Posted by: Revelation at April 15, 2010 9:03 PM

Did anyone catch the preview of next week's episode ? As well how many picked up on the Willie Wonka reference ?

#210. Posted by: Peter Murray at April 15, 2010 9:52 PM

The Willy Wonka refrence freeeked me out, scariest part of that movie. One thing for me to say....I miss Sayeed.

#211. Posted by: Lostwithoutu at April 15, 2010 10:14 PM

It was the same boy, but his hair was wet and thus looked darker. I can't tell whether he himself was all wet, though.

Interesting, considering all of the different watery places on the Island... the Temple Pool, the Well, the swimming hole, the creepy river, etc.

#212. Posted by: cfcinca at April 16, 2010 1:05 AM

I saw the original Willy Wonka in the theater when it first came out, when I was around 9 or 10.

The scene of Gene Wilder in the boat singing the "Rowing Song", while bizarre videos flashed across the tunnel walls such as a chicken getting beheaded, and eventually leading to Wilder screaming the final lyrics- I can't think of any other "children's movie" that ever contained such an incredibly bizarre and disturbing image- it certianly stuck with me for years.

Here's the lyrics for those who have never seen the original (and IMO, superior) WW:

Round the world and home again
That's the sailor's way
Faster faster, faster faster

There's no earthly way of knowing
Which direction we are going
There's no knowing where we're rowing
Or which way the river's flowing

Is it raining, is it snowing
Is a hurricane a–blowing

Not a speck of light is showing
So the danger must be growing
Are the fires of Hell a–glowing
Is the grisly reaper mowing

Yes, the danger must be growing
For the rowers keep on rowing
And they're certainly not showing
Any signs that they are slowing

#213. Posted by: Mizzed at April 16, 2010 1:49 AM

Okay, another of my wild-and-probably-wrong theories:

I always thought Locke's flash-sideways didn't fit the pattern. Because all of the others are of people who are on the island, who are being "rewarded" or "tempted" or something with an alternate fate. But Locke isn't on the island anymore.

So...

What if the alt-Locke in the alt universe is actually the alt-MiB? Escaped from the island into a new universe, populated by the people who went with him on the plane, and living among them like a normal person?

That would explain Desmond's desire to run him over...

But then again I think it will probably turn out Des was just pulling a Charlie and trying to "almost kill" him so he'd flash to the island.

#214. Posted by: Michael Moncur at April 16, 2010 4:25 AM

#209. Posted by: Revelation
===
Hurley OWNED the Box Factory in Tustin.

Locke WORKED at the Box Factory in Tustin.

Not sure where the Mr Cluck Corp HQ is tho.

try Google - "Lostpedia Tustin"

#215. Posted by: Dremel Tool at April 16, 2010 6:19 AM

@215. Posted by: Dremel Tool

You are correct. My point is That Locke was from Tustin... "There once a Chicken czar from Tustin" Hurley was not from Tustin, and while Locke was a turkey, he was no chicken czar.

#216. Posted by: Revelation at April 16, 2010 8:31 AM

@188 Cecil, re Zoe & Chloe: Thanks. I do remember her. Not in that outfit though. ;)

#217. Posted by: Plain Simple at April 16, 2010 10:01 AM

217 Plain Simple, et. al.:

For an interesting blend of 24 and LOST, there was one summer when the Amazing Steve, who does humorous recaps of 24 on Dave Barry's blog took it upon himself to recap a whole imaginary season of 24, in which Jack Bauer and friends pursued the terrorists through a series of fantasy landscapes, each of which as a TV series setting.

Sure enough, on Aug 6, 2007, Jack Bauer and friends ended up on a certain tropical island familiar to us all.

Click my name to go there.

You need to understand two things - the initial Jack in this scenario is Bauer, not Shephard, and the previous 'hour' was spent in Mayberry with a certain sheriff and his deputy.

#218. Posted by: Cecil Rose at April 16, 2010 10:36 AM

I'm cross-posting the following from a piece I just wrote (http://j.mp/cLBF3K). Please take it to heart. This is important to me. -- mac

~~~~~~~~~

Well, I was hoping I wouldn't have to do this, but ...

In recent weeks there's been an unfortunate uptick in negativity around these parts. I'm not sure where that comes from. Maybe it's because the end is nigh? Perhaps it's due to expectations being high (and the threat that they might not be met)? I'm not sure.

Truth is, I don't care.

We're in the home stretch. These are the last few weeks we'll ever have to revel in the anticipation, the fun and the excitement of new "Lost" episodes. This is not the time for snide comments. Back in season three, when many of us were disheartened at the general direction of the series, I understood the frustration and some of the associated comments. But not now. Seriously. Please. Not now.

So I'm asking you, if you've ever enjoyed the conversations in this blog or my reviews or you're just a die-hard "Lost" fan, don't spoil the last few weeks. Let's enjoy this. Let's celebrate all we've had here. Like it or not, things will change once the show is gone. I've experienced this before. It's just the nature of community. So we have a unique opportunity to ride this out in high style, and I say we go for it. Embrace it.

I certainly hope you know I'm forever in your debt for allowing this place to become something very special to me. Let's keep it going for just a little while longer. Let's see it through. That's all I ask.

Put another way: Don't be a Ben. Be a Hurley.

If you've got questions or concerns, feel free to post them below or email me directly (mac@filmfodder.com).

Thanks!

-- mac

#219. Posted by: mac at April 16, 2010 11:50 AM

The pouch that Hurley took was Jacob's ashes. The ones that Ilyana took from the statue. Duh!

#220. Posted by: ALEX ANGEL at April 16, 2010 12:06 PM

Mac, I agree with you 100%. Snarkiness is so.....snarky.

#221. Posted by: undauntid at April 16, 2010 12:18 PM

Thank you, Mac...I agree. Disagreements are inevitable, but disagreements can be expressed in a civil manner.

I also think that MYOB is something that should be reinforced...as in if it's not about a LOST-related opinion & it doesn't concern one personally, not adding fuel to the fire is not only appropriate but helps end disagreements quickly. Just MHO, of course. ; )

I had noticed that the rules about posting that used to show up at the bottom of a thread aren't there anymore...maybe they should be returned? The ones about reading all of the posts before commenting, not posting under multiple names, etc.?

#222. Posted by: Alaïs_Longthought at April 16, 2010 12:52 PM

Ms Longthought:

The blog seems to have a problem with your umlaut, now - at least as viewed from here.

#223. Posted by: Cecil Rose at April 16, 2010 1:17 PM

Whoops, and as soon as I say that, it's back.

#224. Posted by: Cecil Rose at April 16, 2010 1:18 PM

here here mac!!!.....totally agree ;-)

namaste!!!!

#225. Posted by: tiffani at April 16, 2010 1:50 PM

during a re-watch lastnight i tried to have a good look at the guy wearing the chicken suit during dr. changs slide presentation for hugo,
in one shot this guys face is partially visible,
just wondering if this could be yet another LOST easter egg,
if so my guess is that it would be a cameo by one of the producers but LOST being LOST it will probably turn out to be lord lucan!

#226. Posted by: san at April 16, 2010 2:22 PM

#223. Cecil Rose: Missing umlaut:

It was a sacrifice that the island demanded. ; )

#227. Posted by: Alaïs_Longthought at April 16, 2010 2:31 PM

Thank you, Mac. I have been enjoying this blog off and on for a few years now. I was never able to read all of the comments, which means I have never posted. :-) However, I now find myself with a lot of time on my hands, thanks to that pretty pink slip I just received, so I have been reading all of the posts and loving every minute of it.

Anyway...I want to take this opportunity to send a huge thanks to Mac for writing such awesome recaps...I don't know what i would have done without you over the years. In addition, I want to thank all of the posters for their amazing insights and theories. All of you have made my Lost experience that much more enjoyable.

I'm looking forward to, and dreading, the last weeks of THE best show in TV history. Dude...let's enjoy them together!

#228. Posted by: Beth at April 16, 2010 3:01 PM

@mac et al.

The only problem with tinyurl and bit.ly is they don't archive their references indefinitly. I've been re-reading past year's comments occasionally, and tinyurl references from just last year no longer resolve.

So my suggestion is use the facility of the blog, copy the real url into the "URL:" block above and then tell people to click on youtr name.

If'n you think people in the future may still want to see the reference.

#229. Posted by: Cecil Rose at April 16, 2010 3:19 PM

Can anyone remember the reason why, or catalyst that helped Daniel remember the bomb? Is it simply that he saw Desmond at the garden party event, and after seeing his constant, he started to remember?

#230. Posted by: Revelation at April 16, 2010 4:07 PM

@230. Really? Just watch the show again. He states that he saw this gorgeous redhead (Charlotte) eating a chocolate bar and all of a sudden he felt all of these things, wrote down this equation blah blah blah.... It was this love at first sight thing.

#231. Posted by: ALEX ANGEL at April 16, 2010 4:10 PM

@213 -- Gives me the creeps just reading it! I screamed "Willy Wonka" as soon as I heard it during the previews. Of course, my husband just looked at me like I was crazy.

@227 -- You just made me laugh out loud!

@219 -- Thanks, Mac, as always. I'll really miss this blog.

#232. Posted by: srharmon at April 16, 2010 4:19 PM

@230. Really? ...

Thanks Alex now the memory is starting to rush back to me!!

#233. Posted by: Revelation at April 16, 2010 4:24 PM

After MIB took over Locke's body we didn't see Christian anymore. Maybe he needed something from his last host body before he could take over another. Eloise made a big deal to Jack about something from his father (Christian) somehow accompanying Locke's body back to the island. Don't remember exactly what she said but Jack put Christians shoes on Locke's body. Maybe that's why Flocke is now stuck in the body. Anyway Eloise seems to be helping MIB.
In the Alt world in Locke's episode there were quite a few comments that when he was in the bathtub he seemed to have half a light face and half a dark face. I don't think ALT Locke is all good. I think MIB is lurking in him and Des wants to off that part.

#234. Posted by: Kompletely Lost at April 16, 2010 5:12 PM

@234. Posted by: Kompletely Lost

Good point !!

I also remember that Flocke took the shoes off on the Hydra Island.

#235. Posted by: Revelation at April 16, 2010 5:18 PM

@Mac

You are wonderful! Thank you so much for your comments. This blog has been such an escape for me over the last few years. I was really heart sick to see the way things deteriorated so quickly over the last few weeks. I am looking forward to the last 6 weeks and sincerely hope that all of our old, regular posters return for the grand finale! You all make my Lost experience complete...can someone pass me a hanky?

#236. Posted by: lost2theworld at April 16, 2010 5:45 PM

Also about the whispers. My most vivid memory of them was just before Shannon died. Can't remember who had the gun (brian fog) but they kept turning around and freaking out because of the whispers were all around them. Then Shannon came through the brush and startled this person and was killed. The whispers seemed to always be around crazy Rousseau's camp, too.
Should anyone believe Michael on this? or is it a ploy. Couldn't believe Hurley just took his word for it

#237. Posted by: Kompletely Lost at April 16, 2010 6:11 PM

@237 Kompletely Lost:

That was Anna Lucia with the gun. The tailies with Sawyer, Michael and Jin, had just trekked across the island, heading for the Losties camp when Cindy was abducted from under their noses as they attempted to haul Sawyer's stretcher up a hill.

Then the whispers broke out as the rains came, and suddenly Shannon broke into their midst chasing backwards talking wet Walt, Anna Lucia whirled and shot her, thinking her an Other.

Incidentally one of those whispers, according to the transcripts, was "Hi, sis!", lending some credence to ghost-Michael's assertion - Boone was already dead at that point.

#238. Posted by: Cecil Rose at April 16, 2010 6:22 PM

#234 Kompletely Lost: "Eloise made a big deal to Jack about something from his father (Christian) somehow accompanying Locke's body back to the island."

She sure did! You point out that we haven't seen Christian since MIB took Locke's form. That would imply that MIB took Christian's form prior to taking Locke's... If we are correct that MIB can only take the form of a person whose body is on the island then I am baffled because on the original flight 815, Christian's body was misplaced, right? Or so we were told. Christian was not on that flight. Was his body snatched in Australia and brought to the island by I don't know who? Why? With the specific intent of being MIB's new body? Is there any rhyme or reason to choosing a vessel for MIB?

We haven't seen Titus Welliver/MIB since the day The Black Rock landed in the middle of the island. Was Titus also just a vessel for MIB? Is smoke MIB's natural form?

I thought Eloise insisted on something of Christian's going along with Locke's body because she said Christian's body was supposed to be on flight 815, so something of his had to be on the return flight to the island.

#239. Posted by: undauntid at April 16, 2010 6:36 PM

Ok... time for my random thought of the week. A bit late to the party, but that's the price I pay for waiting for it to be shown here in the UK (on Friday evenings) :-)

I'll keep it short, as it's fairly unlikely, but I was thinking about who will turn out to be the "winning" candidate, and take over Jacob's job of keeping the MIB in check.

Locke was a candidate, so what would happen if he was somehow able to take over Jacob's role? He would end up guarding himself, unable to gain the upper hand or find a loophole to murder his guardian. This of course depends on Flocke being able to be somehow recognised as old Locke and then given the job, so I appreciate it's a stretch! It would however mean no one else gets stuck on the Island for the rest of time keeping an eye on him...

#240. Posted by: Stimps at April 16, 2010 6:59 PM

@234. Posted by: Kompletely Lost stated that "After MIB took over Locke's body we didn't see Christian anymore."

I could be wrong on this, and please feel free to correct me if I am, but I thought that the sequence went
- the Aljira 2007 survivors encounter Flocke on the beach
- Sun and Lapidus take the outrigger to the other island
- Christian tells Sun that she will have a long journey to get to Jin
- Ben finds Sun and Lapidus in what used to be his house and they tell him that they were told to wait for Locke (Flocke)
- they look out the window and Flocke waves at them
So...is Christian and Flocke are both MIB, he was able to be both of them interchangably.

#241. Posted by: surefoot at April 16, 2010 7:03 PM

@239 undauntid set forth:

...then I am baffled because on the original flight 815, Christian's body was misplaced, right?

No, on sw815 Chrisians body was misplaced. (Seen this season)


On the original-815 the coffin was loaded on the plane, but when Jack searched the island and finally found it near the cave, it was empty.

>I thought Eloise insisted on something of Christian's going along with Locke's body because she said Christian's body was supposed to be on flight 815, so something of his had to be on the return flight to the island.

My impression was that Eloise's group/faction (whatever that might be) only could calculate the future location of the island, but still had no control over whether the "island-force" (whatever that might be) allowed Ajira 316 and passengers to approach/land on/exit to the island.

Neither had they any control over the original Oceanic 815, which was allowed to see/approach the island by the island force (again, whatever that might be) for its own reasons. But recognizing that something about the makeup of the passengers of 815 allowed them to approach the island (Jacob's summons perhaps? - that put the candidates on the plane in the first place), Eloise's group was determined to duplicate as many factors as possible in the hopes that Ajira would similarly be allowed to approach.

I'm working on a theory that Original 815 was only supposed to fly past the island and have the candidates whisked off the plane, just like Ajira, but the unfortunate concidence of Desmond's lapse at the button led to the plane crashing instead, dooming all the red-shirts to stranding along with the candidates.

If correct, this would indicate that Jin, not Sun, was the candidate Kwon. Similarly, the red shirts of Ajira need not have died, except that breaching the barrier somehow disabled the plane causing it to crash on the Hydra Island.

Also incidentally, all the the folks planning to go back on the Ajira plane seem to have forgotten that something caused it to crash land in the first place.

#242. Posted by: Cecil Rose at April 16, 2010 7:06 PM

@242-cecil,
excellent answer to undauntid,
im kinda the same right now, i get it but i dont sometimes,
always helps to come here where we know we can rely on people like you to make sense of something we may have overlooked or misunderstood,
this blog has been my lifeline since mid season 2,
i cant imagine watching a new episode without reading mac's great review's,
there are many journalists who provide blogs for tv shows,movies etc...
but this one has been special.

#243. Posted by: san at April 16, 2010 8:26 PM

#242. Cecil Rose "No, on sw815 Chrisians body was misplaced. (Seen this season)
On the original-815 the coffin was loaded on the plane, but when Jack searched the island and finally found it near the cave, it was empty."

Geesh...I got lost in time! thank you Cecil.

#244. Posted by: undauntid at April 16, 2010 8:33 PM

The conversation about Willy Wonka started by Crispy Seaplanes and Sunshine makes for an interesting moral comparison with Jacob- WW brings flawed children to his factory, and does nothing while they succumb to their weaknesses and fatal flaws.

The children fall prey to all kinds of physical harm- all of which could have been prevented by Wonka- yet he stands by unemotionally, which has led some critics to downgrade WW as too cruel to be a classic children's story.

Each child was given an opportunity to prove themselves better than their past, and each child failed, leaving only Charlie to win the "prize".

It fits well with the idea of the island as a symbolic purgatory- flawed individuals are brought to the island by a supernatural type creature, giving them the opportunity to find redemption.

But that creature (Jacob) refuses to intervene in their decisions, allowing the people brought to the island to exercise their free will and make their own decisions.

The idea that those individuals who squander this opportunity and fail to find redemption remained trapped on the island, even after their death, seems perfectly consistent with the show's overall themes.

The struggle for the dead to properly communicate with the living has a long tradition in horror and fantasy stories, so I'm not put off as others were by the explanation of the whispers.

The whispers were often heard around times of crisis or danger, such as an attack by the Others or an appearance by Smokey- the dead as observers, frustrated in their attempts to warn the living of the threats ahead.

It's probably not coincidental that MIB cannot communicate to the living as Smokey, but must steal the forms of the dead- those that the characters love and trust (Eko, Christian, Alex)- to make himself understood.

I still like the idea of Smokey as a manifestation of the EMF of the island, but it makes you wonder if at some point in the past it merged with a trapped soul on the island, and it is that soul's remaining consciousness that is obsessed with the idea of escaping the island and passing on.

#245. Posted by: Mizzed at April 17, 2010 12:51 AM

Well crap.

I had hoped that ealgumby could work it out and continue to post... but after 245 posts and not a single peep from him, I gather that he has decided to stick to his decision. I will not question it, out of respect for him, but I will simply say that it saddens me to see him gone.

HOWEVER!

I do want to thank him for all his Lost contribtions to this blog over the years, and I don't know any other place to do so, so please forgive the "off topic" comments, if you see them as such. Many were the times that his posts inspired me to read up on a subject I hadn't looked at in a while, or caused me to consider an interesting plot point I had not thought of.

So... thanks man. Really. We'll miss you.

Take care and enjoy the last episodes,
Mark Dufresne (The Duf all these years)
Fitchburg, MA

#246. Posted by: The Duf at April 17, 2010 2:01 AM

@246. Posted by: The Duf
Well crap.

I had hoped that ealgumby could work it out and continue to post... but after 245 posts and not a single peep from him, I gather that he has decided to stick to his decision. I will not question it, out of respect for him, but I will simply say that it saddens me to see him gone.

I read the vial curse laden diatribe this member laid upon two other people, and I don't understand why anyone would want to hear more of this filth. I don't know why you want this type of responder to come back.

coming to the defense of another is commendable, but this members reaction was way out of line. IMO the intensity of the end did not seam to justify the means, or the originating offense. an overreaction of galactic proportions.

Back to LOST business... will someone please read and comment intelligently on my previous thoughts laid out in 189, 202, or 204. I really need your combined wisdom here.

#247. Posted by: Revelation at April 17, 2010 4:03 AM

To Clarify, The vial post i referred to was #307, by Ealgumby, in the "Happily Ever After" Forum.

#248. Posted by: Revelation at April 17, 2010 4:23 AM

@245 Posted by Mizzed
But that creature (Jacob) refuses to intervene in their decisions, allowing the people brought to the island to exercise their free will and make their own decisions.

I had the opposite impression here. Jacob is the one who intervenes, manipulates, and influences. Jacob gives a push when needed. Freewill is not really in his vocabulary. On the contrary, the MIB, while seen as a violent smoke monster, actually leaves decisions to the free will of the individual. Remember it is Jacob that brings these LOST souls to island, not MIB.

I think Hugo would call Jacob "a total douche"

#249. Posted by: Revelation at April 17, 2010 4:40 AM

@247. Posted by: Revelation at April 17, 2010 4:03 AM ...and I don't understand why you refuse to let it die!

Off topic posts aside, the man has given us many, many brilliant theories and explanations over the years and I for one was really, really hoping to get his insights into things once it is all over.

Now do you think we can all do one little thing for our fearless leader Mad and PLAY NICE???

#250. Posted by: surefoot at April 17, 2010 7:18 AM

oops...make that our fearless leader Mac...although by this point he may be a bit of both

#251. Posted by: surefoot at April 17, 2010 7:20 AM

@249/Relevation: "I had the opposite impression here. Jacob is the one who intervenes, manipulates, and influences. Jacob gives a push when needed. Freewill is not really in his vocabulary."

Well, I'd at least challenge that last sentence:

JACOB: I'm here because I need your help. Can you do that? Will you help me, Ilana?

JACOB: [To Hurley] Ajira Airways Flight 316 out of LAX. Leaves in 24 hours. All you have to do is get on that plane. It's your choice, Hugo. You don't have to do anything you don't want to.

JACOB: Benjamin... whatever he's told you, I want you to understand one thing. You have a choice.

JACOB: Jack is here because he has to do something. He can't be told what that is. He's got to find it himself.

JACOB: Because I wanted them to help themselves. To know the difference between right and wrong without me having to tell them. It's all meaningless if I have to force them to do anything. Why should I have to step in?

It's interesting that the general tone of this board has been to distrust Jacob and to suspect him as the liar and manipulator, while taking MIB as more of a honest source of information.

I would say that at this point, there is no clear, discerning information either way- both characters claim to be advocates of free will.

I think a lot of opinion has been swayed by the posters respect of Mac and his reviews, and since he has been critical of Jacob and his interaction with those brought to the island, that tone has carried over to the blog.

Do we really know anything other than Jacob brings the people to the island, and MIB repeatedly kills them once they get there?

#252. Posted by: Mizzed at April 17, 2010 9:45 AM

One thing still really bothers me about the Hurley-Libby relationship: in the episode "Dave," it was shown that Libby was also a patient at the mental institution, in the same day room as Hugo. But when they came to the island, they did not recognize each other from that place.

Also, Desmond's Mr. Cluck scene with Hurley really mirrored Libby's cafe scene with Desmond when he received her late husband's boat. In both times, the stranger acts like a guardian angel pushing the depressed soul towards their eventual "soul mate."

#253. Posted by: welh at April 17, 2010 10:20 AM

#245 Mizzed: "I still like the idea of Smokey as a manifestation of the EMF of the island, but it makes you wonder if at some point in the past it merged with a trapped soul on the island, and it is that soul's remaining consciousness that is obsessed with the idea of escaping the island and passing on."

I like that idea Mizzed...MIB=a lost soul merged with the EMF and when he says he wants to "go home" he means go to his rest. But, why would that be a threat to humanity?

Unless he is satan and his "home" is in hell where he can orchestrate mass malevolence. Satan is a fallen angel.

The opposing forces here are Jacob who respects free will and MIB who lies and manipulates to achieve the result he wants.

We know that mankind is capable of malevolence without the intervention of satan. Imagine how much worse it would be if satan was actually able to stir things up among those malevolence prone people. Satan is trapped on the island and longs to escape to organize the malevolent folk into an efficient army of darkness?

And it is all about free will. In real life, I reject the concept of "satan". What power does he have that I cannot neutralize by saying, "No." It always rests with me and no one else. I taught my kids that and my grandkids that...We, and only we, are accountable for our decisions. No one "makes" us do anything.

The one bad thing MIB has done is to kill people he cannot use or manipulate. That is the only bad thing he has to do because people are quite willing to do the rest of his work for him...Sawyer clung to and nurtured his rage and murdered not only TMFT, but an inncoent man he thought was TMFT. Ben clung to and nurtured his hurt and murdered not only Jacob, but his father. In the alt time line, Sawyer took the first step of letting his rage go when he finally confided in Miles.

Revelation: I agree with Mizzed about Jacob (re:#252). Yes, Jacob has brought people to the island against their will but that is the extent of his interference. Using that as an example of Jacob's douchery reminds me of the childlike complaint, "I didn't ask to be born." Well, you were born and now you have to cope with life.

The people Jacob brought to the island are facing the same fundamental issue they would face in the real world...When confronted with a difficult situation will they drop their baggage and assess the situation from a place of love or will they cling to past wrongs done to them and act from fear or rage or pain? Rose and Bernard are living a good life on that island. Will they die there? Very probably, but Rose would have died sooner in the real world. And Bernard could have been hit by a bus or killed by a stray bullet fired by a drunken idiot on New Years Eve.

The difference between the island and the real world is that, for whatever reason, these specific people Jacob brought to the island appear to have the opportunity to do a great good for humanity.

#254. Posted by: undauntid at April 17, 2010 11:44 AM

So I read all the comments (!) and the one thing no one has commented is that after Ilana blew up, Ben mentions how she just told them they were all candidates, was there to protect them, and then blew up. "I guess the island was done with her," he says. My immediate thought (and pardon me if it is logical): IF Ilana was there to protect the candidates but is now dead THEN doesn't that mean a candidate has been chosen and she is no longer needed?

Of course, that doesn't mean I know who the candidate is/was...but perhaps Flocke's plan of getting all the candidates together because he needs them all to leave the island (dead or alive is another matter) will be a moot point because one of them is already the new Jacob.

I might be way off, but it seemed pretty blatant to me that Ben made this very clear statement about who Ilana was and was supposed to be doing...so if she isn't doing it anymore, that's got to mean a shift somehow, right?

Anyway, want to say I've loved reading this blog, Mac. Kudos! It has been a great ride.

#255. Posted by: bocgirl at April 17, 2010 5:10 PM

MIzzed -
Tnank you for the insight, and the response to my post!!!! You make a sound and compelling argument for Jacob not forcing anyone to do anything they do not want to do. I still want to know why he intervened in the first place. If the Lost souls on this island need to redeem themselves, and that premise may be flawed, why not let them figure it out for themselves instead of helping them cheat. (For Example: Hurley never would have have known about the Ajira flight if Jacob had not told him about it.) I Know I probably will eat crow very soon, but I still have a gut feeling that something is really wrong with Jacob. I know I am new to posting here, but I am sure that I that you all know more than I do at this point.

#256. Posted by: Revelation at April 17, 2010 7:17 PM

Not sure if this has been discussed, but has anyone else thought about this?

For SOME of the characters (e.g. Jack, Sawyer, Desmond, Hurley), they have more financial success in their alt-lives, yet they do not have LOVE.

Yet when they were broken and went to the island, they found true love.

Some other characters (Locke, Sun, Jin) seem to be happier in their alt-lives and have love -- yet they run into bad situations in their alt-lives.

Not sure if this means anything, but it's just been on my mind.

#257. Posted by: Ann at April 17, 2010 8:17 PM

#246. The Duf & #250. surefoot:

Thank you for your kind words re ealgumby. We really appreciate hearing them. He was sure that if he posted anything again, he would be personally attacked, & unfortunately his feeling was borne out; he didn't even have to post anything & was personally attacked.

#247. & #248: Revelation: You missed a few things in your posts, so let me clarify them for you. You seem to have missed #257, in which I was flamed because the poster totally misinterpreted what I said in #242. You also seem to have missed that #262 & #273 defended me, & that the poster in #257 apologized in #271. That, as Mac has said, should have ended it right there. Yet in #287, a poster w/no connection to the issue flamed ealgumby, followed by a second poster at #294, who not only had no connection to the issue but who freely admitted that he hadn't even read the original posts I have referenced above. And now you, a third poster w/no connection to the original issue, feel compelled to continue the personal attacks by condemning someone who speaks favorably of ealgumby...even after Mac has specifically asked in #219 to refrain from taking the low road.

Mac, I do apologize from bringing this up again, & I don't plan to do so again...I most likely won't be here anymore. But if I were to remain silent, I would be allowing ealgumby to be scapegoated by three posters who are the ones to blame for blowing the original issue into a huge problem because they couldn't mind their own business.

"All it takes for evil to triumph is for good people to do nothing." —attributed to Edmund Burke (not Juliet's husband, though).

#258. Posted by: Alaïs_Longthought at April 18, 2010 12:15 AM

Ah man, I missed the Willy Wanka reference? Can you describe what they showed? My DVR broke and I got a new one so I cannot go rewind it to see....

#259. Posted by: Christina at April 18, 2010 2:27 AM

@ 258 - Per Mac's request, I am staying off the insult trail as well. But it saddens me that ANY poster here, and particularly an erudite poster of many years, should be "chased off" for ANY reason, let alone an impassioned response based on LOVE, which just happens to be what Lost is about!!

Ah, the irony. Thick as Hurley's secret peanut butter stash.

#260. Posted by: The Duf at April 18, 2010 3:09 AM

The last two episodes have been excellent! I'm very happy and thankful that the writers are able to connect the remaining pieces of the puzzle with so much creativity and beauty!

Just two little details which stood out to me in the last two episodes:
- Desmond meeting Penny at the stadium reminded us of the first meeting between Desmond and Jack. Although there may not be a directly causal connection between these two meetings, it had some beauty in itself.
- I really liked the Hurley/Libby connection in the alternate timeline which actually has the potential to make one of the most confusing scenes on Lost much more believable (the scene from one of the early seasons where Libby was shown as another patient in the psychiatric ward).

Some more speculations about the "vaccine" and Desmond's abilities:
- maybe the vaccine does not only protect Desmond from MIB's "infection" but, more generally, it protects him from the damages which would normally result from high doses of electromagnetic energy. As welh noted, Desmond possibly wasn't the only person who did receive this vaccine at some point. However, Desmond injected himself with this vaccine on a daily basis for a very long period which could have built up some kind of tolerance (I mean tolerance in contrast to immunity).

Additionally, because of his proximity to the event, Desmond was exposed to the largest dose of electromagnetic energy during the hatch implosion. We already know that this event was the cause of his special abilities.

Maybe the vaccine is the reason why he was able to survive this event. His tolerance to electromagnetic energy may additionally protect him from MIB's spell/infection (which, i.e., did work on Sayid).

I find it interesting that computers (and therefore also software programs) are driven by electromagnetic energy which brings me back to the question of what the island is... ;)

#261. Posted by: Margot at April 18, 2010 8:27 AM

@#258. Posted by: Alaïs_Longthought at April 18, 2010 12:15 AM

What about my pain? Ever since Ealgumby's last personal attack against me, I have been crying basically non stop and I am afraid to leave my house. He has made me a target and now... sob, damn, here I go again. But never mind little old me, I'll get over it eventually.

#262. Posted by: Mischa at April 18, 2010 8:43 AM

Guys, please. I know some folks are still upset, and I respect that, but you'll need to find another channel if you want to discuss it further. I can help set that channel up if that would be helpful.

I'm going to have to remove any additional comments on this matter. I'd prefer not to have to do that.

#263. Posted by: mac at April 18, 2010 9:01 AM

@ 261. Posted by: Margot

Very thought provoking ! I will have think about this a while.

#264. Posted by: Revelation at April 18, 2010 11:10 AM

Well . . . now I’m back in town and caught up with all the “distractions” here in our little world . . .

Gosh, Alaïs and ealgumby, don’t leave the party now . . . with only a few more weeks to go! (In six seasons, who HASN’T ranted here at one time or another!?!) . . . and anyway . . . We would miss you at the alumni party next year at a central location yet to be announced where the “celebration committee” is planning a big MUD HOLE GROUP WAGGLE!

Hey, who wouldn’t want to part of that!?!?!

#265. Posted by: davidrh at April 18, 2010 11:54 AM

I loved "The Human Fund" reference. I have also logged in too many hours with Seinfeld. Funny, when I heard it my first thought was....oh, George wasn't lying, it IS a real charity...LOL

I must also be REALY out of it because I didn't know two posters were girlfriend and boyfriend....did you guys meet on here?

#266. Posted by: meg at April 18, 2010 1:04 PM

#265. Posted by: davidrh

Not sure what a MUD HOLE GROUP WAGGLE is but it sounds like fun--I'm in!

#267. Posted by: Crispy Seaplanes at April 18, 2010 1:34 PM

I loved "The Human Fund" reference. I have also logged in too many hours with Seinfeld. Funny, when I heard it my first thought was....oh, George wasn't lying, it IS a real charity...LOL

I must also be REALY out of it because I didn't know two posters were girlfriend and boyfriend....did you guys meet on here?

#268. Posted by: meg at April 18, 2010 1:43 PM

woo-hoo! MUD HOLE GROUP WAGGLE. Haven't done that since college. Bikini tops were optional, back then. Bottoms were mandatory, cuz you just don't want mud in certain places.

#269. Posted by: Chairee at April 18, 2010 2:40 PM

Obviously Chairee KNOWS what a "waggle" is! (If I remember - Mazola Oil was the lubricating element of choice.)

Or at least, that's what I heard . . .

No first-hand knowledge.


Really.


#270. Posted by: davidrh at April 18, 2010 7:25 PM

im not quite sure how we made it from electromagnetic energy to mud hole group waggle but what the hell.,
im up for that!

#271. Posted by: san at April 18, 2010 8:30 PM

why'd the chicken cross the road? to get outta earshot of all the silly whining at the LOST blog.

#272. Posted by: Tater Nutz at April 18, 2010 9:13 PM

Boy.... I'm sure I've stated this a zillion times, but here I go again!

When you step away from this blog for several days, boy is it ever tricky to catch up! As such, I've been part of both camps - the annoyed by the repeaters who can't be bothered to read, as well as the casual poster who innocently wants to chime in, but is overwhelmed by the hundreds of comments already posted.

I've been guilty of both committing the crime, and being annoyed by it (on odd occasion). I think the regulars need to chill a little on this. I think it is fair game to make fun of it - I just hope no one is seriously upset by it.

The great thing about this blog is the diversity of contributions that it receives. Some people put in great time and effort here, while others muster up the energy and courage to post a quick thought or two, or even a thought that has been mentioned a zillion times over. In the end - who cares! This blog should be friendly to ALL.

As Mac has suggested, isn't this how Hugo would want things?


I was going to reply to a bunch of posts, but will stick to a small few.

@156. Posted by: lostncyberspace
re: Hugo Reflector

I re-watched, and can confirm that there is no mirror reflection of Hugo in the episode. However, with that said, we do experience multiple images of Hugo that can be considered "reflections". There is the slide-show at the awards ceremony, which reflects images of Hugo doing various nice things. There are also the Chicken advert posters, which have Hugo in them. Not sure if this means anything, but just wanted to confirm.


@219. Posted by: mac
re: Don't be a Ben. Be a Hurley

Amen brutha! I couldn't agree more! Someone needs to write "The Tao of Hurley"!

@263. Posted by: mac
re: additional comments on this matter

I completely agree, and as such, I will not respond @258, though I must admit - I am tempted to do so! Actually - the onset to this post can be considered as my response!

In any case - Let's all enjoy what's left of the island together...

#273. Posted by: shikotee at April 19, 2010 12:07 AM

So just to bring things back into the world of Lost speculation, I've seen a lot of debate around how Christian can be both MIB and also appear to Jack off-island.

My take is that MIB (prior to his incarnation as Locke V.2) primarily communicates through appearing as loved ones whose bodies it encounters on the island: Yemi, Christian, Alex, etc.

Smokey does not reanimate these bodies- as an example, Yemi's corpse gets charred by Eko, but instead it assumes their form, ala a shape shifter.

In my mind, that does not mean all appearances of the dead are Smokey. In Lost, the dead are still able to appear to the living to deliver a message to the living- but only if (big if) the living are ready and receptive to hearing their message.

Hurley is receptive, and is essentially a "Sixth Sense" type of radio antenna to the dead. My guess is that the dead who have appeared to him off-island: Charley, Ana Lucia, Eko- are unlike Michael, and are not trapped souls on the island.

For those deceased who did not die on/near the island, such as Isabella or Christian, they can appear wherever/whenever, but only when their loved one is ready to receive their message.

In Isabella's case- Smokey "stole" her memory from Richard on the Black Rock, then assumed her shape in an effort to manipulate Richard into killing Jacob.

The Isabella that Hurley saw a century plus later was actually her true spirit, delivering a message that Richard needed to hear.

Christian is an identical example- Smokey appeared on-island as Christian to Jack, Claire and Locke as part of his manipulation, to move them forward along the "loophole" path.

But Christian's true spirit appeared to Jack off-island, to deliver the warning that Jack "was not supposed to raise him"- not Aaron, as Jack assumed, but Locke.

Since Christian did not die on island, there is no reason to believe his soul/spirit would be trapped there, and this explanation would be consistent with the theory that MIB is trapped on the island, and can not venture off, even in pseudo-ghost form.

#274. Posted by: Mizzed at April 19, 2010 12:40 AM

@275. Posted by: Mizzed

What's puzzled me is why Christian is dead in the sideways world? Why did nothing change for this poor guy? I say this primarily because I miss the actor, but I do wonder if there is some significance?

#275. Posted by: shikotee at April 19, 2010 1:06 AM

@268. Posted by: meg
re: I must also be REALY out of it....

Been hitting up the vino? ;)
Just tossing out the random memory that struck my mind when you posted...

PS - Sorry that I was first! :(
I always did enjoy giving chase on that, back in the day....

#276. Posted by: shikotee at April 19, 2010 1:28 AM

@274 Shikotee -Thanks for your post, and the reminder about the posters and slideshow *could* subsitute for a reflection, but it is a switch from the rest of the altflashes.

Maybe it means nothing but my inquiring mind doesn't like these kind of diversions if they serve no purpose.

I can't wait for Tuesday although I will be watching it much later than usual as I'll be flying south of the 49th bright and early tomorrow.

#277. Posted by: lostncyberspace at April 19, 2010 10:46 AM

@275 Mizzed:

What or who is ghost Christian is still open for debate. Off-island, it could be the spirit of Jack's father. But on-island, Christian may be different because he is just as manipulative as Flocke. Example: when Locke fell down the well to the FDW chamber, why Christian's image (Locke never had met him before)?

#278. Posted by: welh at April 19, 2010 10:50 AM

I wonder if I'm too old for the mud hole group waggle. If I am can you please post pictures afterwards. Sounds like more fun than bear cage sex.

#279. Posted by: Kompletely Lost at April 19, 2010 11:51 AM

@278. Posted by: lostncyberspace
re: reflections

Yeah - it certainly is a stretch. Could be indicative that Hugo is unique? But yeah - seems like a dead end on this. I guess only time will tell!


@275. Posted by: Mizzed
@279. Posted by: welh

I agree with welh - it is far from clear who\what\why Christian was. I certainly hope they resolve this by the end - ie why a body in a coffin on a plane seemingly is something that MIB is into (or needs). Off island, it could very well be someone/thing else manipulating Jack via an image of his dad. Or, perhaps the simplest answer is true - that Jack was seeing things due to all the drugs he was pumping into his body.

#280. Posted by: shikotee at April 19, 2010 1:10 PM

My memory is not reliable but generally isn't the difference between "ghosts" and manifestations of MIB in various forms that everyone can see MIB manifestations but only Hurley can see the ghosts?

We've seen manifestations of MIB appear to people when no one else was around...Yemi appeared to Eko, but had a third party been present they would also have seen Yemi.

The Kid in the jungle is a different matter...so far it seems anyone can see him which surprises Flocke. That Flocke is surprised that someone else sees The Kid hints something...I just don't know what.

#281. Posted by: undauntid at April 19, 2010 1:28 PM

@282. Posted by: undauntid
re: "ghosts" and manifestations

Not entirely clear about the "everyone can see manifestations" bit. On the island, was Dave a manifestation, or simply a figment of Hugo's imagination?

I also think it is key that Flocke asks Sawyer if he saw the jungle boy, but do not know what it means. My money is still on it being a young Jacob, whom has not been seen like this since back in the day. Flocke has not seen him in this form since, likely because Jacob was not "dead" (whatever that actually means) during all that time. As such, it is a new experience for Flocke to see this type of image.

Back to Yemi - Way back - Didn't Locke (or was it someone else) have a dream with Yemi in it. Who be responsible for the weird dreams people have had? Or are they coincidental?

#282. Posted by: shikotee at April 19, 2010 1:47 PM

@283/Shikotee

We can add "projections" to the list. Remember Horace chopping wood at the cabin, then his image skipped like a record?

#283. Posted by: welh at April 19, 2010 2:04 PM

Why is Frank Lapidus on the island?

#284. Posted by: Revelation at April 19, 2010 2:10 PM

#283 shikotee: Now that we know Hurley can see dead people, I think Dave was a dead person who appeared to him. And I think Dave was Libby's husband, David. Dave can't be a manifestation of MIB because his body isn't on the island. And I don't think MIB can manifest off island because what's all the fuss about keeping him on the island if he already comes and goes as he pleases?

"Everyone can see the manifestations" By that I meant two things: Everyone saw Christian in the old barracks when they saw the photo of LaFleur's group. And Claire and Locke both saw Christian in the cabin (when Claire appeared to be very stoned). So I am making the leap that, had there been a third party present, that person would have seen Christian in the well with Locke and on the beach with Jack and with Claire prior to her abandoning Aaron and they would have seen Yemi immediately prior to Eko's murder. And both Sawyer & Kate saw her horse.

Locke's dream of Yemi: I figure that was a dream...people have weird dreams all the time. As teenagers, my sister and I each vividly dreamed of our future beloved. Mind boggling when, years later, we each met the man in the dream.

Welh: I'd completely forgotten about that projection of Horace that kept skipping! So, yeah, that's another thing!

#285. Posted by: undauntid at April 19, 2010 3:11 PM

@284. Posted by: welh
re: "projections"

Yup - I'm sure there are other little thingies that we are forgetting too!

re: Blast Door Map

Just took a peek at your blog, and let out a sentimental sigh when I saw the map. Man - was that ever exciting when we first saw it! It seemed like it would play a huge role, but not really all that much too it.

I'm still puzzled by Radzinsky. We know he designs the place, but how does he end up being stuck in there? Why was he never replaced? How did Dharma send Inman out there, and how did the person that he replaced leave?

Remember how back in the day, it was the rage to assemble a fictional island map? Has anyone maintained a current one, or is it pretty much impossible to exist due travel times, locations, etc. I'd love to see a current map of the island, just to see how everything fits in.

#286. Posted by: shikotee at April 19, 2010 3:13 PM

@287 shikotee:

The odd thing is that of all the Dharma mysteries and questions (when Science theory was The Explanation of All Things), only Room 23 suddenly pops up this season.

Coupled with the fact that characters are getting forehead injuries left and right, I really don't want a mind control explanation for the sideways world or vice versa.

#287. Posted by: welh at April 19, 2010 4:55 PM

And the backwards audio from the Room 23 brainwashing tape:

"Only fools are enslaved by time and space"

#288. Posted by: welh at April 19, 2010 5:04 PM

@289 welh ... I know what you mean about the head injuries.... seems like too many to be coincidences. I keept trying to find a connection between all the main characters that will be a major clue as to whats going on.

Did anyone see the finale of the American version of Life on Mars? IMO I think they did a good job of explaining things, by pulling together everything he heard and entwining it with the *today* he lived in.

I don't think LOST is going in that same direction but I like the overall idea/theme of the LOM finale.

#289. Posted by: lostncyberspace at April 19, 2010 5:58 PM

@285 Posted by: Revelation
Why is Frank Lapidus on the island?

Someone has to fly the Ajira plane, I don’t think Flocke or anyone else could do it.

#290. Posted by: bfried7 at April 19, 2010 6:14 PM

Last week it was a recycled episode title.

This week it's a face familiar to LOST fans showing up on House.

Click my name for a preview.

#291. Posted by: Cecil Rose at April 19, 2010 6:16 PM

@285 & @290 -
As a pilot, yes he could fly the Ajira plane, but what I meant was why Frank Lapidus? Any pilot could do that. Frank was supoposed to fly the original Oceanic flight 815,(Note: his replacement is ripped to pieces by smokey) but he overslept, then he ends up as the chopper pilot for the freighter team, and now he is the pilot for the Ajira flight. Why him? what is the significance?

#292. Posted by: Revelation at April 19, 2010 8:36 PM

are we to be treated to another jack centric episode this week?
i find it so distracting when jack has a conversation with another character,
when i chat to someone in person i generally look in the direction of their face,
something jack seems unable to do,
if he was talking to me i would be saying to him "what the hell is more interesting over there than what im saying to you"
in this episode during a conversation between jack & hurley in the jungle i found it hard to concentrate on the dialogue as the doc looked everywhere but the person he was talking to,
as i have never seen matthew fox in any other tv show or movie im not sure if this is maybe his acting style.
@292-cecil,
as i said a while back in this blog,
mrs.san is a huge fan of HOUSE so i watch it also,
i now love the show but have to look at older recaps from you as we are so far behind episode ways here in the UK.

#293. Posted by: san at April 19, 2010 8:38 PM

@245 mizzed - My thoughts as well on the Willy Wonka - Jacob parallels. Also dig that those who squandered their redemption possibilities are the islands whispers - the trapped undead, so to speak. And Smokey as the manifestation of the island's EMF merged with tortured souls. I never rewatched, but seems I remember someone posting here about seeing "faces" in Smokey as it passed over Kate and Claire in the Silence of the Lambs pit at the Temple - there you go.

@261 Margot - Speaking of EMF, nice speculation on Des's daily dose when in the Hydra (so long ago!) station. Another question answered!?

@247(189,202,204) Revelation - Has it actually been stated or anything more than implied on the show that the position our candidates are in the running for is Jacob's? I don't recall anything. It seems to have arisen here and on other blogs. There may be another position the writers have in mind.

@250-251 surefoot - Mad Mac? - say it isn't so!

@283 shikotee, @286 undauntid - Seems to me that Locke's vision of Yemi occurred when he was ensconced hallucinating away in his homemade sweat lodge, just before Eko became Smokey's Main Character Victim #1.

ABC.com has up the 5 finalist fan promos. Two of them, "The LOST Life" and "Obsession" deal with a subject near & dear to all of our hearts.

<> Slight Spoiler Alert <>
Also previews on ABC.com include a Sun/Locke rolling gurney encounter en route to the ER.

#294. Posted by: robinpiney at April 19, 2010 8:39 PM

Interesting shows on Science channel tonight. Michio Kaku had two epis one on time travel and one on parallel universes.
The Parallel one was very interesting and sounded a lot like what the frozen donkley wheel does to me. There was also an explanation of how one parallel universe cannot exist without the other.
You can watch them here.
http://science.discovery.com/videos/sci-fi-science-videos/

#295. Posted by: berkyo at April 19, 2010 9:24 PM

@294 posted by robinpiney -

Has it actually been stated or anything more than implied on the show that the position our candidates are in the running for is Jacob's?

In Dr. Linus,
Ilana tells Sun that she is there to protect them because they are candidates.
Sun asks about being a candidate for what?
Ilana replies "You're candidates. To replace Jacob"

#296. Posted by: revelation at April 19, 2010 9:31 PM

@295. Posted by: berkyo

Speaking of interesting shows...

Did anyone check out the US debut of the latest Doctor Who? Just curious. How available is BBC America in the US?

I'm telling you folks - hop on board. It's the show that will never end! ;)

#297. Posted by: shikotee at April 19, 2010 9:58 PM

@296 revelation - Guess I'm minimalizing Ilana now that she Arzted herself! Interesting that Ilana was asked that by Sun, who we're not exactly sure is a candidate.

Rewatched "Everyody Loves Hugo" and noticed the similarity of the emotional timbre of the characters in the scenes with Desmond/Flocke at the well and in the high school parking lot and the scenes with Jacob/MIB on the beach at last season's end and breaking the wine bottle in "Ab Aeterno." Hmmmm...

<> Attitude Spoiler Alert <>
According to lostpedia.com ABC will break up the first-run episode batch down the home stretch, airing a rerun of "Perdido En Ricardo" ("Ab Aeterno") April 27th before resuming with episode 14 om May 4th. Telenovellish indeed, Dr. Chang!

#298. Posted by: robinpiney at April 19, 2010 10:19 PM

Shikotee @297 -I watched Dr Who it was awesome.

#299. Posted by: lostncyberspace at April 19, 2010 10:28 PM

Upon second viewing Richard's challenge to the group might speak to how the series ends: "I'm going to make this simple, if that thing leaves the island, that's it, it's over, everything."

Did the writers just describe the final scene to us ? The MIB escapes the island and everything fades to black ?

#300. Posted by: White Rock at April 19, 2010 10:45 PM

@294. Posted by: robinpiney
re: <> Slight Spoiler Alert <>

So - all signs seem to be pointing towards our Losties getting together at the hospital. Locke was hit by a car - Ben will likely go with him. Sun has been shot. Sayid's brother is there (I think). Was anyone at all injured in the Kate/Sawyer/Miles thing? Whiplash? Maybe Claire will give birth? Who else? What would draw Hugo?

I'm wondering - island Sun lost her English. We've seen that in the sideways world, trauma triggers memories. I wonder - Will sideways Sun inexplicably speak English? I so see this happening!


@299. Posted by: lostncyberspace
re: Doctor Who

I read that BBC America hit a record with 1.2 million viewers tuning in. I thought it was a very strong first episode for a new Doctor.

Mmmmmmmmm - Fishsticks and custard!

#301. Posted by: shikotee at April 19, 2010 11:08 PM

@278/welh: "But on-island, Christian may be different because he is just as manipulative as Flocke. When Locke fell down the well to the FDW chamber, why Christian's image (Locke never had met him before)?"

Here's my rationale for on-island Christian as MIB/Smokey:

The Smokey mechanical sound was heard at least twice just before/just after the appearance of Christian on-island.

The first time Jack saw Christian, he was led to run over a cliff- only Locke's arrival saved him from serious injury/death.

Unlike the ghosts on island/off island, Christian appeared to be fully corporeal- able to hold Aaron, for example.

Christian's appearance on-island and its emotional manipulation mirrored almost exactly the scenarios involving Alex in the temple and Isabella in the Black Rock- both of which were pretty clearly Smokey manifestations.

Christian's message to move the island became the pivotal moment in the MIB "loophole" plan.

As for why MIB needed to appear as Christian to Locke, it was so he could send Locke off with the message "say hello to my son".

When Locke delivered that message to off-island Jack, it broke the idyllic "oceanic 6" spell, and sent Jack on the road to tortured, bearded Jack, starting the process which led to the return to the island (with dead Locke in tow).

#302. Posted by: Mizzed at April 19, 2010 11:16 PM

294 robinpiney pined:

>@250-251 surefoot - Mad Mac? - say it isn't so!

Surely you remember Mad Mac, Beyond Thunderdome?

#303. Posted by: Cecil Rose at April 20, 2010 12:00 AM

@294robinpiney and 303 Cecil Rose...oh thanks guys, now I have that stupid Tina Turner song stuck in my head! ;P

Shikotee @297 asked who watch Dr Who...watched and enjoyed. I really like the new Dr. And that is coming from someone who has been watching since before Tom Baker!

#304. Posted by: surefoot at April 20, 2010 12:39 AM

When Des was at the chicken fast food place with Hurley...they called out the #42 several times and he said "that is me" and probably sure he said "brother". #42 must be Desmond's number!

#305. Posted by: Jack at April 20, 2010 1:24 AM

@252, Mizzed: "Do we really know anything other than Jacob brings the people to the island, and MIB repeatedly kills them once they get there?"

And not even that. We have seen very little action from Jacob, only some dialogue, a lot of which is cryptic and some off-Island touching.

We know a bit more about MIB. He kills and he seems to be relatively open about most things, but not everything.

Neither of those two characters seems to be very trustworthy. A killing sociopathic puff of black smoke and a cryptic possibly kidnapping and manipulative ghost.

@254, undauntid: "Unless he is satan and his "home" is in hell where he can orchestrate mass malevolence. Satan is a fallen angel."

Actually, if I remember correctly, in the Hebrew Bible "ha-satan" was the name of one or more angels who were sort of the prosecutors for god, pointing out the flaws in humanity and saying either "go get him/her", or "let me have a go at him/her". This could jibe very well with what MIB seems to be doing. In later stories the name got used in a lot of different contexts as well, leading to a fairly convoluted mess as to what "satan" is supposed to be. In the light of the "Garden of Eden" scene a few episodes back in "Ab Aeterno" it is interesting to note by the way, that the snake in the bible story is never identified as anything other than a snake, so I'm not sure Flocke's scary staring in that scene can technically lead us to link him to satan. Otoh, I guess if TPTB are using the satan character as a template for Flocke, they're going with the idea of satan as he (she? it?) is depicted in popular culture.


@254, undauntid: "Revelation: I agree with Mizzed about Jacob (re:#252). Yes, Jacob has brought people to the island against their will but that is the extent of his interference. Using that as an example of Jacob's douchery reminds me of the childlike complaint, "I didn't ask to be born." Well, you were born and now you have to cope with life."


Did you just compare what is basically "being kidnapped" with "being born"? Surely there is a difference between (a) someone intentionally whisking people away from their lives and trapping them on a mysterious Island without their consent and (b) bringing about the start of a new life. You seem to very easily accept that "Jacob has brought people to the island against their will" as if that is not a bad thing.


@258, Alaïs_Longthought: I will refrain from commenting on the matter, apart from saying that, if you and ealgumby stick with your decisions to stay away from the blog, I will miss your contributions for the final episodes. And the same goes for any of the other posters who might have been chased away by this unfortunate Incident (capitalized so I can't be accused of going off-topic ;-) )


@285, undauntid: "So I am making the leap that, had there been a third party present, that person would have seen Christian in the well with Locke and on the beach with Jack and with Claire prior to her abandoning Aaron and they would have seen Yemi immediately prior to Eko's murder."

Who knows what Aaron saw.


@298, robinpiney: "@296 revelation - Guess I'm minimalizing Ilana now that she Arzted herself! Interesting that Ilana was asked that by Sun, who we're not exactly sure is a candidate."

Iirc also Flocke told Sawyer back in Jacob's (?) Cave that the names where for candidates to replace Jacob to protect the Island, after which he said that there is nothing to protect the Island from.


@297, shikotee: "Did anyone check out the US debut of the latest Doctor Who? Just curious. How available is BBC America in the US?"

I never really got into Doctor Who for some reason, but I happened to catch The Eleventh Hour and was very entertained. I might tune in more often.


@301, shikotee: "I'm wondering - island Sun lost her English. We've seen that in the sideways world, trauma triggers memories. I wonder - Will sideways Sun inexplicably speak English? I so see this happening!"

I wouldn't be surprised!

#306. Posted by: Plain Simple at April 20, 2010 1:46 AM

@robinpinney- regarding all meeting at the hospital...did'nt Hugo mention to his mother this past week that they had to go to another function? Perhaps it is some charity event at the hospital?

#307. Posted by: lorna at April 20, 2010 2:10 AM

Anyone think Juliet Burke happens to be related to Dr. Burke (Libby's doctor)? Odd they have the same name...or am I just forgetting some thing?

#308. Posted by: Christina at April 20, 2010 2:33 AM

@299 Posted by robinpiney -

Neither Hugo nor Desmond have had a mirror encounter (unless you want to count Hugo in on Jack's lighthouse smash-up.) And they both seem to be the two most "pure" of the canditates. Theories?

What do you mean by "Pure"?

#309. Posted by: Revelation at April 20, 2010 3:17 AM

@304. Posted by: surefoot
re: Time Lords and whatnot...

Glad you enjoyed. Does BBC America also show The Sarah Jane Adventures? This is a sci-fi drama that is much more geared for children focusing on the adventures of Sarah Jane Smith. It was announced that Katy Manning (3rd Doctor's companion Jo Grant) and Matt Smith will star in a two episode arc for the 4th series, which will be out in the UK during fall 2010.


@306. Posted by: Plain Simple
re: Jacob and MIB - neither trustworthy

Agreed. I'm still not convinced that Jacob is benevolent. I keep waiting for the episode where the table will flip, and we will get a better understanding of what he is, and what his responsibility is for the actions of MIB.

re: never got into Doctor Who

I was drawn to the show when I was but a wee one, when they were re-broadcasting the Tom Baker years on public television here in Canada in the early 80's. Some very fond memories of being frightened out of my wits! That was my hook. All in all, bringing back the series in 2005 has worked out well. Sure - there have been hit and misses, but this is to be expected. It's nice to see the show being produced with a much more acceptable production budget!

@308. Posted by: Christina

Alas, Dr. Brooke and Dr. Burke do not share the same last name. I thought I heard Burke as well. TPTB - stop messing with our heads! You know we are trying to make links everywhere!!!! ;)

#310. Posted by: shikotee at April 20, 2010 8:47 AM

@304. Posted by: surefoot
re: Time Lords and whatnot...

Glad you enjoyed. Does BBC America also show The Sarah Jane Adventures? This is a sci-fi drama that is much more geared for children focusing on the adventures of Sarah Jane Smith. It was announced that Katy Manning (3rd Doctor's companion Jo Grant) and Matt Smith will star in a two episode arc for the 4th series, which will be out in the UK during fall 2010.


@306. Posted by: Plain Simple
re: Jacob and MIB - neither trustworthy

Agreed. I'm still not convinced that Jacob is benevolent. I keep waiting for the episode where the table will flip, and we will get a better understanding of what he is, and what his responsibility is for the actions of MIB.

re: never got into Doctor Who

I was drawn to the show when I was but a wee one, when they were re-broadcasting the Tom Baker years on public television here in Canada in the early 80's. Some very fond memories of being frightened out of my wits! That was my hook. All in all, bringing back the series in 2005 has worked out well. Sure - there have been hit and misses, but this is to be expected. It's nice to see the show being produced with a much more acceptable production budget!

@308. Posted by: Christina

Alas, Dr. Brooke and Dr. Burke do not share the same last name. I thought I heard Burke as well. TPTB - stop messing with our heads! You know we are trying to make links everywhere!!!! ;)

#311. Posted by: shikotee at April 20, 2010 8:48 AM

Hmmmmmm....

Sorry for the double post.

There seemed to be a brief disturbance in the space time continuum. Like last week, I was stuck on that blank screen. I opened the URL in a new tab, and the comment was not there. So - I pasted and sent it. Then - both appeared.

I blame Desmond....

#312. Posted by: shikotee at April 20, 2010 8:53 AM

@#312 shikotee I blame Desmond...

Island-Desmond or Alt-Desmond...? ;o)

#313. Posted by: Boodle at April 20, 2010 8:57 AM

@313. Posted by: Boodle

At this juncture, I can't help but wonder if there is a difference.

"Only fools are enslaved by time and space"

Desmond is seemingly no longer a fool.

#314. Posted by: shikotee at April 20, 2010 9:34 AM

@314. Posted by: shikotee

At this juncture, I can't help but wonder if there is a difference.

"Only fools are enslaved by time and space"

Desmond is seemingly no longer a fool.


And now Desmond lies in the shadow of the statue!

#315. Posted by: Revelation at April 20, 2010 9:51 AM

@309 revelation - Granted that just about all the main characters on LOST are their own worst enemy, the motives for Hugo & Desmond seem to be more altruistic than the rest. The acts in their past have by and large hurt themselves rather than others - yes, there are exceptions! They are not primarily seeking revenge or vindication, but seem to be genuinely concerned for their island mates welfare.

They also (depending on the timeline!) seem to be more at home in their own skin than most other characters. That may be part of why each of them seems to have gained "special powers" since coming to the island - or vice-versa.

Looking forward to the resolution between Des & Sayid. Like Sayid, Des seems more zombie-like in his reactions to folks since his EMF booster and I feel Sayid's catatonia may well be at least partially an act - he didn't "shoot 1st & ask questions later" when he retrieved Desmond as Flocke would have apparently liked.

#316. Posted by: robinpiney at April 20, 2010 9:57 AM

@316. Posted by: robinpiney

OK now I get the "Pure" reference.

#317. Posted by: Revelation at April 20, 2010 10:00 AM

GRAA, Mac!

Late to the game again, but some questions and comments from last week's episode:

As discussed previously, 42 is the answer to the ultimate question of life, the universe and everything (Hithchiker's Guide). Ergo, Desmond is *The Answer.*

Wonder whether Hugo also won the lottery in the alt timeline and, if so, what numbers did he use?

Is Dr. Brooks in cahoots with Mrs. Widmore, following my thought last week that they have a reason for trying to keep the love connections away from one another in alt-LA.

Anyone know where I can get the whispers DVD? That would make some Scooberific surround sound in my dude pad!

Is Michael, through mind games, trying to recruit Hugo to Flocke's camp?

Is Desmond, in alt-LA, doing the same sort of recruiting in reverse?

Seems to me the biggest question of the season is simply: What is the alt timeline and what does it represent.

Is this the first time Jack has seen Flocke?

@59 and 62 Shikotee illustrations:
Those were laugh out loud funny! Keep 'em coming.

And davidrh rant @174
Always good for my chuckling agreement.

@291 Cecil. Was good to see Libby (Cynthia Watros) back on network TV. For friends of Tom Friendly (M.C. Gainey), noticed his voice in the commercial for the upcoming show Happy Town.

#318. Posted by: Scooby-Dude at April 20, 2010 10:42 AM

I thought KWON was 42,Oo is that just Desmonds order # at the chicken joint?

#319. Posted by: Revelation at April 20, 2010 10:48 AM

"@247(189,202,204) Revelation - Has it actually been stated or anything more than implied on the show that the position our candidates are in the running for is Jacob's? I don't recall anything. It seems to have arisen here and on other blogs. There may be another position the writers have in mind."

In "The Substitute" (the title itself is a hint, eh?) Flocke tells Sawyer the names on the wall are candidates to take over Jacob's role as "protector of the island." Of course he's lying, manipulative smoke so who knows if he was telling the truth......

#320. Posted by: glostover at April 20, 2010 10:49 AM

Yes, I was just referring to Desmond's chicken order being #42.

Noticed some symmetry during last week's episode:

In their first meeting in the Hatch, Desmond had Locke tied up (by Kate). Here, Flocke has Desmond tied up.

Flocke is dying to get off the island, but Locke did whatever he could to stay.

(And interesting how Hugo pulled a Locke move by blowing up the TNT....unless he was protecting everyone by preventing another BOOM Goes Ilana/Arzt.)

@68. Posted by: Lost4ever
Exactly! I think he meant to kill Locke. I think the timelines will eventually intersect...Des ran down the real JL to take away the opportunity of Flocke leaving the island thereby keeping him trapped?

Agreed. It did appear that Desmond mowed down Locke in reaction to Flocke throwing him down the well. Guess we'll have to wait and see how/whether they're related.

@80. Posted by: BEMH
Did Desmond know that Locke was dead? If so, why is he pretending he doesn't know Locke's body is now occupied by MIB?

Good point. I don't remember it coming up during the activity surrounding the introduction of the Lamp Post station, but I have to believe he heard the news from someone, right? But then if he knew Locke was Flocke, why did he follow him into what seemed like an obvious trap?

@107. Posted by: BEMH
Desmond is reconnecting everyone with their "constants"

That's interesting, could be. Would be a nice tie-in to the classic Constant episode.

Any guesses as to what was in the mini satchel? Should that be our parlor game until 9pm EST today?

#321. Posted by: Scooby-Dude at April 20, 2010 11:25 AM

@321. Posted by: Scooby-Dude
re: Any guesses as to what was in the mini satchel?

My guess is that the following items are in the mini satchel:


- 2 dogeared scripts (stuffed in the top)
- 1 Sub-Etha Sens-O-Matic
- An Electronic Thumb
- A device that looked rather like a largish electronic calculator (with the words DON'T PANIC printed on the cover)
- a few ballpoints
- a notepad
- a largish bath towel from Marks and Spencer
- a bag of peanuts

#322. Posted by: shikotee at April 20, 2010 11:45 AM

@322 shikotee:

Plus one bag filled with water containing a small fish, which you'll just need in your ear...

Possibly the collected works of Paul Neal Melne Johnson?

#323. Posted by: Cecil Rose at April 20, 2010 12:33 PM

@323. Posted by: Cecil Rose Plus one bag filled with water containing a small fish, which you'll just need in your ear...

Would that be a babble fish?

#324. Posted by: Revalation at April 20, 2010 12:38 PM

302 Mizzed: 'Christian's appearance on-island and its emotional manipulation mirrored almost exactly the scenarios involving Alex in the temple and Isabella in the Black Rock- both of which were pretty clearly Smokey manifestations."

If Isabella on the Black Rock was Smokey, then it is NOT necessary for a body to be on the island in order for MIB to manifest as that dead person. But...Richard was wearing Isabella's crucifix; maybe that is enough for MIB???

306 Plain Simple:
'Did you just compare what is basically "being kidnapped" with "being born"? Surely there is a difference between (a) someone intentionally whisking people away from their lives and trapping them on a mysterious Island without their consent and (b) bringing about the start of a new life. You seem to very easily accept that "Jacob has brought people to the island against their will" as if that is not a bad thing."

What I was trying to say is that because (we are told) the future of mankind rests with at least one of those 6 candidates, I see it more as "drafted" than "kidnapped". So you are correct, I do not think of it as a bad thing. I especially don't think of it as a bad thing if Jacob bringing those people to the island against their wills was to prevent the annihilation of 6 billion people.

#325. Posted by: undauntid at April 20, 2010 12:43 PM

I find interesting that MIB says that Jacob stole his body, and then MIB steals John Locke’s body. (Assumption on my part)

Or did someone else?

If he did, does that mean that MIB was dead when Jacob stole his body just like John Locke was dead when his body/likeness was stolen?

Futhermore, could that mean that MIB was Jacob’s last replacement.

Just a thought. now I am go and let my head expload ala Arzt and Ilana…

#326. Posted by: Revelation at April 20, 2010 1:17 PM

I'm back!!!!!! Anyone notice I was gone?
ANIWG??

#327. Posted by: Skipper at April 20, 2010 1:31 PM

@314

Not only is he no longer a fool, but he has lost all his fear and has nothing but faith, something seemingly he needs right now (being at the bottom of the well) he knows the island isn't done with him.

#328. Posted by: popcorn machines at April 20, 2010 2:06 PM

#327. Posted by: Skipper

NBNWKYB---GTSYA

#329. Posted by: sandivon at April 20, 2010 2:40 PM

@324 Revalation asked:

>>@323. Posted by: Cecil Rose Plus one bag filled with water containing a small fish, which you'll just need in your ear...

>Would that be a babble fish?

Yes, although spelled Babel Fish, and pointed to by some scholars as a logical proof of the non-existnce of God, because for anything as staggeringly useful as a fish which inserted in ones' ear that translates all known languages to have evolved by chance is simply too far out, and so must have been created by God and is proof of the existence of God. But, Proof denies Faith, which is what the God business is all about. "Oh, dear," says God," hadn't thought of that." and promptly vanishes in a puff of logic.

#330. Posted by: Cecil at April 20, 2010 3:00 PM

OK. Now my head is really going to explode!!! This thought just occured to me:

MIB is trying to get home. Maybe His home is on another timeline. The MIB timeline was altered way in the past, and the timeline we have seen leading up to flight 815 crashing, and desmond using the failsafe, is not the real timeline. The pre-815 lives our Losties know as reality, is actually the result of the original alteration back in MIB’s day. By going home, MIB sets the time line straight, and the alt reality we see for our Losties is actually the intended reality. Everything we have seen in the sideways world is the true timeline, and everything pre flight 815 was the alternate universe created back in MIB’s time.

#331. Posted by: Revelation at April 20, 2010 3:16 PM

@325, undauntid: "What I was trying to say is that because (we are told) the future of mankind rests with at least one of those 6 candidates, I see it more as "drafted" than "kidnapped". So you are correct, I do not think of it as a bad thing. I especially don't think of it as a bad thing if Jacob bringing those people to the island against their wills was to prevent the annihilation of 6 billion people."

So the end justifies the means, even if we have no reason to believe it was necessary to bring these people to the Island without at least telling them what is going on? Is a world where "might makes right" and you just have to shut up and undergo whatever is asked of you for the greater good without any say in the matter worth saving? Perhaps, but it doesn't make me particularly happy.

#332. Posted by: Plain Simple at April 20, 2010 4:56 PM

#310. Posted by: shikotee
SORRY I didn't realize the names were different. They sounded the same to me on the show. But yes, I see you are right. Sorry. Wasn't trying to ''mess with your mind''.

#333. Posted by: Christina at April 20, 2010 5:13 PM

@333. Posted by: Christina

No apologies needed! I was merely joking about how the show runners deliberately throw us such curve balls just to mess with us. This was similar to a few episodes back when everyone thought that Keamy mentioned the island in the sideways world (he didn't - it just sounded funny).

On a side note - grumble grumble! For the last few weeks, Lost was good to go @7pm here in Toronto. Alas - not tonight. Back to 9pm!

Grumble...... Grumble...... Grumble!!!

#334. Posted by: shikotee at April 20, 2010 7:15 PM

TGIT!!!

Great discussions going on here for the last several days! I've been crazy busy so haven't been keeping up as usual. Just caught up quickly, so here are a few thoughts.

@Mizzed...as always, I love the way your mind works. Are you really Damon or Carlton, messing with us all? C'mon, fess up!

@Scooby-Dude...I propose that the satchel is filled with ever-lasting gobstoppers, hence the Willy Wonka reference at the end of last week's episode.

@Christina...I thought I heard Dr. Burke too. I agree with shikotee that we are all looking to for subtle connections and miss what's really there in the process. I think we should all watch the show with subtitles! ;-)

@Skipper...Where were you? LOST? (Tee, hee, hee.)

@shikotee...I would LOVE it if sideways Sun stared speaking English. THAT would be classic!

Forgive my delirious rambling. I need to sleep but it is Lost night so that won't happen before 10 EST. Tah, tah for now.

#335. Posted by: lost2theworld at April 20, 2010 7:36 PM

@330. Posted by: Cecil

Speaking of Babel fish....

Douglas Adams was both a writer and script editor for Doctor Who during the Tom Baker years. Along with two other writers, he co-wrote one of my personal favourites - "City of Death" (that also has the random John Cleese cameo appearance). Click my name for more details.

30 minutes....

#336. Posted by: shikotee at April 20, 2010 8:29 PM

@334, shikotee: "On a side note - grumble grumble! For the last few weeks, Lost was good to go @7pm here in Toronto. Alas - not tonight. Back to 9pm!"

Same in Vancouver, but I probably won't be able to see it before tomorrow anyway.


@335, lost2theworld: "I think we should all watch the show with subtitles! ;-)"

Actually, I usually have close captioning on. I'm not sure how accurate it is, but it does prevent confusion, like with Keamy's mumbling.

#337. Posted by: Plain Simple at April 20, 2010 8:34 PM

What's in the satchel? Hmmm, gonna do some stream of consciousness here.

Paulikki's Diamonds
Jin's ring
Mikhail's eye
Nadia's picture
Jacob's Ashes
Catbarf
Richard's Cross
Bullwinkle's Rabbit ("Hey, Rocky, Watch me pull a rabbit out of a hat")
Bunny #8
A chicken leg
Cindy's Scarf!

Or, going in a completely different direction, I propose that the satchel contains something that should remain in the satchel:

Locke's gullibility
Sawyer's anger
Kate's running shoes
Jack's boneheadedness
Sayid's ease of killing
Hugo's VW driving skills (oh wait, we might need that one again!)
Sun's lying
Jin's bad aim
Ben's Ben-ness
Richard's eyelinerness
Juliet's dying and waking up for 2 seconds only to die again-ness
Charlie's forgetting he's in a Lost episode and not Flash Forward-ness
Desmond's snowglobe-prison-ness
Michael's Waaaaaaltness
Walt's absentness

Oh wait, I got it. It's a cork!

#338. Posted by: Scooby-Dude at April 20, 2010 8:40 PM

#331. Posted by: Revelation

I have been trying all week to sort through this same thought process.

When Danielle was taking the group to the Black Rock on the first trek out, she said the smoke monster was a security system for the island. I would like to think that after 15 years on the island she would know what it really is.

After reviewing the scene with Flocke and Kate on the beach, I'm thinking that Flocke's goal is to go back in time and correct the problem that made his mother crazy. That would allow him a normal life. I also feel he was trying to say that by reliving life, Claire would not be crazy either.

Even though I'm leaning on him being the good guy, it's hard after he does things like dumping Desmond in the well.

Maybe Flocke got caught in the time chamber down in the Orchid and his body never came back together.

On with the show!!!

#339. Posted by: pebspostal at April 20, 2010 8:59 PM

CATBARF!!

Sometimes I just like to say that.

#340. Posted by: Clementine at April 21, 2010 10:33 AM

If those characters who are in the Sideways dimension are not stuck on the island as a dead soul, then what is Charlie doing in that dimension? Like Michael, he has committed a major sin. Murder. One could say that he had redeemed himself in the S3 finale. But Michael had redeemed himself in the S4 finale.

So, what is really going on?

#341. Posted by: Rosie at May 15, 2010 3:27 AM